Leaders of the Alliance. MUST SEE.

Not quite fair, Quin. Exaythe was there on her own merit as a non GM. JP was there as a non GM. Jayse was there as a non GM. It wasn't GMs, it was 'people who can get shit done'. And the easiest way to prove you can get shit done is to form a guild. The much harder way is hosting continual events, contributing to the community in a tenacious and positive way, or building a non guild community to generate RP.

But if you think you can make a better meeting with no GMs in attendence. Well, I'd love to see it done.

Mostly what Ataris said in my opinion. I think people should have a main and stick to it. Sure, make alts to help out a one off event but they don't really need to be in a 'one of evil guild' for that to work. I'd prefer we had a dozen small stable guilds with 80% (arbitrary number is arbitrary) of people logging in every week than half a dozen HUGE (on paper) guilds with six members logging in a month, rarely at the same time. That sort of activity kills guilds and what I will now term excessive altage is to blame.

That said I don't think the community is that hard to get into, join a guild. If you don't want to join a guild then ask a guild where it hangs out and visit them there. I think people are over timid about approaching people and it's a shame. But short of spamming General chat there is NOTHING I can do to make myself or my guild more accessible to the unguilded. :S

I still think that at this moment the desire for 'cultist guild' is a relic of the last 5 years when cultist-guilds were present. What we need, is antagonism. Antagonism doesn't necesserily have to involve Cultists vs Paladins

Just to name some examples of possible antagonism involving already existing guilds:
-House Dieudonne is trying to rally the nobles and strengthen the House of Nobles at expense of the council, and fight for values and interests of the nobles rather than common people, while DIsciples of Light and Chapter oppose for their own reasons.

-The Three Hammers are trying to get influence in Stormwind and over Stormwind guilds to raise the dwarvish race to prominence in the Alliance above humans

-Blades for Hire are believed to have grievously dishonored the contract they had with the Disciples of Light, and are now doing constant side-swapping and alliance-making to fend off the danger

-Chapter decides that Stormwind is better off under the White Cross and begin a relentless campaign to convert and recruiting, while chapter-opponents rise to contain what they believe is fanaticism

-Cartel, Blades for Hire and those with liberal sentiments consort together to lobby the council and make a more 'free', criminal-friendly Stormwind

-Disciples of Light and the Chapter bury the hatchet and decide that only way alliance can win, is through faith and discipline, and work together to 'impose' a form of Holy Law upon Stormwind, and educating people in the ways of the Light, while 'atheists' and criminals move in to oppose the idea.

-Kingdom of Stromgarde is seeks Ironforge's political support to break free from vassalage.

-Knights of Dawn believe that Lordaeron has highest priority, and lobby the orders and guilds to attend to the North, while leaving Stormwind in the hands of thugs and criminals, to which some patriots from across the guilds say 'no' and move in with a counter-promotion, saying that Stormwind comes first.

I'd still like to understand why the admins deleted my comment which was just agreeing or adding ideas to the points Gene made out -.-

So you hold a meeting that only invites people that are part of a small closed community and come up with the notion that people that aren't part of said community need to be involved more?

Doesn't that seem sort of self defeating? You'd be better off posting rp discussions on these forums where anyone can take part, if you want to get more people involved.

no the problem is that the rp community needs to find ways to involve the random Rpers that are in pve guilds and perk guilds and the like that do want to RP now and then. since we all started somewhere, and not just unguilded people.

and that hermetically shutting ourselves off from all the "hardcore pve/pvp" elements isn't going to entice people to rp, or let people know where rp is on a certain day, because i believe the community in general is kinda skittish about others walking in the sandcastle the wrong way.

and i believe that if you want to rp, you can find it whereever with some effort like it has always been. sometimes it seems to drop before your feet, and other periods it will seem empty until you create it with difficulty, be it random or planned.

but if we want more blood, we'll need to get more open somehow.

that said, summer is coming along so time for the periods with rediculous activity followed by ghosttowns and no possibility to plan it decently.

right, what we need to do is this, stop worrying because fortunately my uber brain and mind death job means i have come up with an answer to 90% of all the points raised!

The answer...

A RP leveling guild!

Basiclly i recken call it something like Citizens of the alliance then get all your un guilded or wanky guilded alts into it. It will be a guild of individuals, no big plot or nout so maybe people who are un-guilded and happy that way could join too Next, we gat loads of newbe rpers into the guild. It mixes newbes and vets together, they can offer advise, maybe hold clinics on emotes or lore ect.

the beauty is then new rpers have a place to go, if you see new rpers then the community can send them to the guild. Where the ooc guild name is seen others will know they are rpers so it will stimulate random RP people want. It totally does away with the "there in a perks guild" issue. One of the aims of the guild will be to train and then direct newbes to the best RP guilds for their char, maybe also it can help out guilds that are finding recruits tricky.

Another idea i had was to make the ranks like rookie and vet, so other rpers will be able to identfy the newbes and hopefuly offer guidance and give them some slack. Maybe as well there can be a guild rank for example shop keepers, that way if people want to rp as tradesman they can too be identfied and be apart of the community.

Also the guild can be used as tackle dummies for events where disposables are needed, If run right the newbes can really learn from it. Maybe too it can be a place for any born to die alts!

so random rp improved, vets and newbes mingling and playing together, a supply of goons for events and a place to assist in guild recruitment. Where be the down side...

i can only think of two. Firstly it will be a level one guild. It will take a few months to lvl it. I guess it would ask people to take a small hit to their lvling for a short time (although the benifits could be massive to Defias Bros!)

Secondly is getting the officers for it. I recken if we get like 10 - 20 officers (!) then there will be one online most of the time and the guild will be hunting out newbes with a chaptarian like zeal. So it will demand alittle time from every one.

So what do you think?

Tulene wrote:I'd still like to understand why the admins deleted my comment which was just agreeing or adding ideas to the points Gene made out -.-

I believe that was just a mistake. Not sure if you have been contacted about it yet, but if you haven't you will so don't worry. You did nothing wrong

Glad to hear this went well; I caught wind there of someone mentioning the Twilight Hammer, is this developing into a guild/non-guild organization? If so i'd like to lend my hand.

Dreth's idea is awesome. A guild called <DBRoleplay> Or something. A guildus perkus for roleplayers only! With guidance and such indeed. I'd definitly put all my unguilded characters in such a guild, rather then guildless or those OOC perk shit guilds.

Edit: Dreth if you ever plan to set something up like that then poke me and I'll lend a hand actually. My main is guildless anyways (well, made an own ooc guild just for the tabard, but I can live without tabard.)

Cool well Crojwin if all think about the same the plan is to kick it into gear tomorrow (two events tonight XD) I think i prefer your name to mine, does exactly what it says on the tin.

If we can get 8 or so people to help then all will be peachy

(also if this takes all the legitermacy of the ooc lvl guilds from the server then bonus!)

also if this takes all the legitermacy of the ooc lvl guilds from the server then bonus!)

Exactly. Sure we'd have to start from lvl one where the ooc perk guilds are 25 already, meaning we don't got it all right away, but it's something the RP community should work on. An investment.

I'd imagine the guild have rules too. Like no trolling in the chat, maturity in general, the what should be common sense although common sense tends to be far away in those ooc perk guilds

I'll give you myself a poke tomorrow. Though, is the RP community actually interested in this?

Defo agree, We can sort out the details. I want to stress that a communication and education approach is FTW in this IMO rather than banhammers. Hopefully it will work. As you say it will be a group investment for the whole server so it will take people lvling alts to give them up. (even hordies as players will flip but their RP "education will flip with them)

I like the idea of a Rping perks guild. I might actually get a high level alliance for once!

Is guild perks really the problem? And if it is, why are roleplayers more interested in these perks than the actual roleplay they experience, then go to lengths to complain about how they can never find roleplay.

It is due in to wanting to lvl an alt to a higher level before roll playing it. It is something some players do i am told, not uncommon. If the guild idea works however it avalable to all roll players. It could even help develop a back story to a char, maybe even roll play as a child in the guild and an adult when you leave.

But "guild perks" are sucking alot of new role players. The spamming of start zones sucks many into their grasps for example. and new rpers might misguidedly be thinking Dungeons and raids rather than Where good Roleplay is.

Wether it's the problem or not, I don't know personally. However, I still think Dreth's idea is awesome. The guild could be a good source for Rp as well. Both to new and old roleplayers. And like Dreth said, it will be used to guide people as well, the newer once. I know for one, that when someone asks in that guild chat if someone wants to Rp, I'll say SURE, come on over to darkshire o// Just one example out of the many.

From this guild we can also point for example Maelmoors event out, so that they are aware of it and such. And not to mention to point them to defiasrp.com ( not everyone watches wow-europe.com after all)

Ah, I can see it being rich of posibilities.

Guilds perks aren't that fantastic. And to put it bluntly since we restarted the Seal we've hit the cap every day in addition to the raiding/dungeon challenges. So the odds of a casual levelling guild supplying more perks than the RP community can already provide are slim.

I do really like the idea though. I'm not sure what would draw people to it though, over say the Blades, or DoL, or any other guild that suits their characters theme?

That said, I do my best to recruit anyone who shows the right attitude regardless of how 'potentially embarassing' they are. Maybe that's a better solution, we all stop caring so much for our 'image' and, whilst still recruiting only RPers (of course), open our doors to people who may not be perfect members?

It is not initially about the guild perks. It would be an OOC tag that houses roleplayers who have no guild, and the perks could draw them to us (because otherwise they might as well join guildus perkus or blues brothers).

But what you create by doing so, is indeed the roleplayers that are in guilds for perks. You have them united, which brings easier communication for RP.

Who would join this guild rather then the blades, seal or DoL? Well, alot of people are choosing guildus perkus / blues brothers above those guilds right now. Those people are what should be drawn to this guild. Not to mention the new roleplayers who wish to taste and look around first before joining a solid guild concept.

And naturally people who show the right attitude are able to join (perhaps a brief ooc interview by an officer) even if they might be "embarassing." It's a guild full of roleplayers after all, and they can support eachother/guide eachother. No trololololeetspeak chat, so to speak. You don't have to be perfect.

That's how I am seeing it atleast. But I guess me and Dreth will have a little chat session tomorrow so we can get things on paper and present it on these boards, in a new thread for discussion and feedback, to keep this one a little more clean.

I support the idea of a guild for 'new' RP-ers and somewhere for people fresh to server to learn the in's and out.

I mean we accomodate this in the Blades anyway, new members have to go through a combat trial and IC interview to ensure that at least some basic understand of RP is present, if it's not they are invited as a trainee who is not given a tabard IC'ly or OOC'ly until they have learned the ropes.

Slightly diversion, sorry - Point is; I support the idea of a RP learning guild but I have my apprehensions as well, it must be clear that the guild has no other 'motives' it is for training, it should not have agenda's or it's own ongoing plots, that just confuses things far too much. Sure, players in the guild can develop whatever they want and ask for support, but the guild should have an anonymous name. Players should be encouraged to start developing their own 'background' and be encouraged to find a guild that suits their characters needs the best and not stagnate in this 'training' guild at the risk of stifling other RP Theme'd guilds.

Yes Raloris that is a 100% correct, that's the idea

By your logic TTH should be flocking with people now that it's level 25. I don't think Guild Perks are an issue at all. What benefit does a guild perk provide to your roleplay other than the mass summon in case people are too lazy to fly/mount to the area of RP?

Tulene wrote:By your logic TTH should be flocking with people now that it's level 25. I don't think Guild Perks are an issue at all. What benefit does a guild perk provide to your roleplay other than the mass summon in case people are too lazy to fly/mount to the area of RP?

Isn't 400+ members flocking with people?

Considering that quite alot of them are alts of the more devout members... no.

I'd join an RP-er run alt levelling guild with characters I simply hadn't decided what to do with yet, or who I often RP but who currently have no guild affiliation. Rohwyn, for example. It would be nicer than levelling unguilded!

Valerias wrote:I'd join an RP-er run alt levelling guild with characters I simply hadn't decided what to do with yet, or who I often RP but who currently have no guild affiliation. Rohwyn, for example. It would be nicer than levelling unguilded!

seconded.

On a related note, DoL has always been open to new roleplayers and tried to help them in their steps from beginner's level to a higher level. I can say from personal experience that "methods" of roleplaying aren't shunned on forum or guild chat. Rentarn proved a tremendous help in his more active days. I try to continue his work.