ERP means Durp?

Buren wrote:Undead cant erp as they have no genitals btw.. They dont have the blood to get an erection.. Romatic rp is as far as they -can- go. I dont know about hormones though

Now that I think of it... I drew a comic about this once....

Spoiler:

Undead have their... benefits!

Valdar/Melan wrote: I can't believe that nobody has (or maybe they have, and I just havn't noticed it) made the point about how insanely paradoxal it is that everyone is going berserk that 12+ year old "children" could possibly be exposed to sexual content while it's, morally, perfectly acceptable to expose them to no-holds-barred violence and death.
Why do we need to shield children from sex and not torture, murder, terrorism, alcoholism, genocide and so forth? If I emote something along the lines of "Valdar jams his dagger into Melan's throat, grunting as he twists it, blood spurting out over his mask and armour." it is perfectly acceptable, but if I should emote something along the lines of "Valdar heatedly kisses Melan and presses his hand against his crotch." I have committed a great moral crime? And yes, I'm asking you to look past the fact that it's a Blizzard guideline and look at the moral/ethical question that is the reason for the guideline.

In my opinion, this mindset is an ugly remnant of the once so popular Media Effects Model with theories such as the Hypodermic Needle Theory and the Magic Bullet Theory. In most academical spheres, this model is largely dismissed as unscientific and out dated. However, in certain political spheres (like the American Christian Conservative Right) it is very popular. Not because this theoretical model has much merit to it, but it applies to their values.

Perhaps you should stop viewing 'children' as passive and realize that their viewing of the text (I.E this game) is far more active than you speculate.

Now, of course you shouldn't ERP in public channels. It is quite rude to other people RPing in that area, and it requires very little effort to create a party.

I'm sorry if my post was messy and my point sloppily made.

Except violence is something children engage in since infancy....throwing toys at their siblings being bullied and fighting back etc violence and death are something introduced to a living being from it's first days in the world....heck even when it's a baby they slap them....violence and death is something we can't seperate from children at all as they're perfectly familiar with it from their home lives or from their school lives.

As well as the fact every living creature and being is familiar with the concept of what death is.

As for the sex part that brings them to life well from my viewpoint and from experience when i was 11-12 when i was in school is that children should be learning of this stuff from an Adult whom is a proffessional in teaching those who are coming into their teenage years about what sex is....yes they have a good idea but really Children should learn in the proper time and place about sex and hear about if and of it in a proper adult professional setting....not from some pervert on world of warcraft who just wants to get his end away.

People really overestimate how 'innocent' 12 year olds are.

Gor'Thrak Frosthowl wrote:People really overestimate how 'innocent' 12 year olds are.

12 year olds are not innocent at all they bully they punch they ridicule they hate because that is just what children do...but they should learn these things just like with everything from an adult proffesional who knows what they're talking about not some person on WoW.

Also people lie about their age on this game DoL has had one or two who've been 15 years old and claimed they were 18 so that other Roleplayers would take them more seriously in Rp. So in essence the ERP'er themselves is in danger of being a

Burgen wrote:

Valdar/Melan wrote: I can't believe that nobody has (or maybe they have, and I just havn't noticed it) made the point about how insanely paradoxal it is that everyone is going berserk that 12+ year old "children" could possibly be exposed to sexual content while it's, morally, perfectly acceptable to expose them to no-holds-barred violence and death.
Why do we need to shield children from sex and not torture, murder, terrorism, alcoholism, genocide and so forth? If I emote something along the lines of "Valdar jams his dagger into Melan's throat, grunting as he twists it, blood spurting out over his mask and armour." it is perfectly acceptable, but if I should emote something along the lines of "Valdar heatedly kisses Melan and presses his hand against his crotch." I have committed a great moral crime? And yes, I'm asking you to look past the fact that it's a Blizzard guideline and look at the moral/ethical question that is the reason for the guideline.

In my opinion, this mindset is an ugly remnant of the once so popular Media Effects Model with theories such as the Hypodermic Needle Theory and the Magic Bullet Theory. In most academical spheres, this model is largely dismissed as unscientific and out dated. However, in certain political spheres (like the American Christian Conservative Right) it is very popular. Not because this theoretical model has much merit to it, but it applies to their values.

Perhaps you should stop viewing 'children' as passive and realize that their viewing of the text (I.E this game) is far more active than you speculate.

Now, of course you shouldn't ERP in public channels. It is quite rude to other people RPing in that area, and it requires very little effort to create a party.

I'm sorry if my post was messy and my point sloppily made.

Except violence is something children engage in since infancy....throwing toys at their siblings being bullied and fighting back etc violence and death are something introduced to a living being from it's first days in the world....heck even when it's a baby they slap them....violence and death is something we can't seperate from children at all as they're perfectly familiar with it from their home lives or from their school lives.

As well as the fact every living creature and being is familiar with the concept of what death is.

As for the sex part that brings them to life well from my viewpoint and from experience when i was 11-12 when i was in school is that children should be learning of this stuff from an Adult whom is a proffessional in teaching those who are coming into their teenage years about what sex is....yes they have a good idea but really Children should learn in the proper time and place about sex and hear about if and of it in a proper adult professional setting....not from some pervert on world of warcraft who just wants to get his end away.

Are you seriously comparing the violence portrayed in RP to the kind of "violence" that children (in our part of the world) experience? When was the last time you saw a kid rip out the innards of another kid in the school yard? When was the last time a child dropped an atomic bomb (read: mana bomb) on a densely populated city? Now, I'm not saying that we -shouldn't- do violent RP, of course not. I'm remarking on the paradox of tabooing sex, but not violence. I'd rather we didn't taboo.

And yes, I agree that maybe children shouldn't engage in ERP themselves, and yes, I think that ERP should be 'kept behind shut doors' as it were, but there is a logical fallacy in condemning ERP and condoning violent RP. Similarly, it's a logical fallacy to assume that individuals who engage in ERP are A) perverts or B) doing it for sexual pleasure or both.

Assumption is the mother of all fuckups.

PS. Being a professional and being adult does not make you a non-pervert. Just putting it out there.

Gor'Thrak Frosthowl wrote:People really overestimate how 'innocent' 12 year olds are.

Well possibly, I still would not feel comfortable "doing it" in front of them however. If the litergy of screenies over the years has taught me anything, it is that lots of people ERP, including the "big names" of RP. Logically it has no real bearing on your ability to RP anyway, I dont care really provided it isnt done publicly or anything. I cant see how this kind of mentality could be argued with imo.

Valdar/Melan wrote:

Burgen wrote:

Valdar/Melan wrote: I can't believe that nobody has (or maybe they have, and I just havn't noticed it) made the point about how insanely paradoxal it is that everyone is going berserk that 12+ year old "children" could possibly be exposed to sexual content while it's, morally, perfectly acceptable to expose them to no-holds-barred violence and death.
Why do we need to shield children from sex and not torture, murder, terrorism, alcoholism, genocide and so forth? If I emote something along the lines of "Valdar jams his dagger into Melan's throat, grunting as he twists it, blood spurting out over his mask and armour." it is perfectly acceptable, but if I should emote something along the lines of "Valdar heatedly kisses Melan and presses his hand against his crotch." I have committed a great moral crime? And yes, I'm asking you to look past the fact that it's a Blizzard guideline and look at the moral/ethical question that is the reason for the guideline.

In my opinion, this mindset is an ugly remnant of the once so popular Media Effects Model with theories such as the Hypodermic Needle Theory and the Magic Bullet Theory. In most academical spheres, this model is largely dismissed as unscientific and out dated. However, in certain political spheres (like the American Christian Conservative Right) it is very popular. Not because this theoretical model has much merit to it, but it applies to their values.

Perhaps you should stop viewing 'children' as passive and realize that their viewing of the text (I.E this game) is far more active than you speculate.

Now, of course you shouldn't ERP in public channels. It is quite rude to other people RPing in that area, and it requires very little effort to create a party.

I'm sorry if my post was messy and my point sloppily made.

Except violence is something children engage in since infancy....throwing toys at their siblings being bullied and fighting back etc violence and death are something introduced to a living being from it's first days in the world....heck even when it's a baby they slap them....violence and death is something we can't seperate from children at all as they're perfectly familiar with it from their home lives or from their school lives.

As well as the fact every living creature and being is familiar with the concept of what death is.

As for the sex part that brings them to life well from my viewpoint and from experience when i was 11-12 when i was in school is that children should be learning of this stuff from an Adult whom is a proffessional in teaching those who are coming into their teenage years about what sex is....yes they have a good idea but really Children should learn in the proper time and place about sex and hear about if and of it in a proper adult professional setting....not from some pervert on world of warcraft who just wants to get his end away.

Are you seriously comparing the violence portrayed in RP to the kind of "violence" that children (in our part of the world) experience? When was the last time you saw a kid rip out the innards of another kid in the school yard? When was the last time a child dropped an atomic bomb (read: mana bomb) on a densely populated city? Now, I'm not saying that we -shouldn't- do violent RP, of course not. I'm remarking on the paradox of tabooing sex, but not violence. I'd rather we didn't taboo.

And yes, I agree that maybe children shouldn't engage in ERP themselves, and yes, I think that ERP should be 'kept behind shut doors' as it were, but there is a logical fallacy in condemning ERP and condoning violent RP. Similarly, it's a logical fallacy to assume that individuals who engage in ERP are A) perverts or B) doing it for sexual pleasure or both.

Assumption is the mother of all fuckups.

PS. Being a professional and being adult does not make you a non-pervert. Just putting it out there.

You've obviously never heard of History classes then y'know the ones where we learnt about the vikings,battle of hastings,World war 1,World war 2,The Celts,The Picts. I was learning about the violence of the vikings at age 7 and the celts and picts at age 9 coming into watching a video on the atrocities of sobibor at age 11-12 and seeing someone condemed to the gas chamber trying to escape to be then mauled by the attack dogs of the death camps guards.

Also these adult proffessionals i speak of are people like Doctors and Nurses and for them to be able to go into a school and teach children of this they need to pass certain checks and disclosures to be allowed onto premises.

Kids are taught so much violence, what is wrong with teaching them about Love, romance and.. Whats the word I'm searching for, not sex but..

Help me out here, I em not saying that we should go out on the streets and yell "I just had sex! Want to know about it?!"
Just saying that I don't see what is wrong with kids getting taught about the better things in life instead of just violence.

ERP is not love and Romance that is a complete and utter fallacy propogated by those making excuses for themselves. As for love and romance most children with a good upbringing learn that themselves from their own lives and from their parents from children through teenage years into their adult years......ERP'ers shouldn't and don't need to "teach" children these things.

I've got to agree with Burgen there. ERP is not for kids, and it's not a very good source for learning about "love".

I for one am just going to ignore Burgens posts. Not because I'm offended, or upset, but due to his responses when people have tried to discuss it with him. Maybe it's really elaborate trolling, but I'm not responding to it either way.

I can't stand bigotry and ignorance at the best of times, and his posts are filled with both of those.

On that note, don't share your ERP with anyone other than the intended target. It's just common decency. Stay classy San Diego.

Edit: And yes, be mindful of ages/maturity levels.

I do not think anyone ever suggested young teens should learn about love through ERP... Nor that ERPing with minors is okay. I am not against ERP, but anyone whom goes about ERPing with minors has a /gkick with their name on it.

I think the only thing that was suggested that love and sex are not as bad as all the violence that is in this game. But the same goes for TV shows and movies... It's okay to shoot someone through the head, but OMG THERE IS A TIT ON SCREEN!!!

Emrys wrote:

Buren wrote:Undead cant erp as they have no genitals btw.. They dont have the blood to get an erection.. Romatic rp is as far as they -can- go. I dont know about hormones though

Now that I think of it... I drew a comic about this once....

Spoiler:

Undead have their... benefits!

I SEE BOOBS! CENSOR THEM WOMAN, YOUNG ONES VISIT THIS FORUM!

Emrys wrote:OMG THERE IS A TIT ON SCREEN!!!

Rare moments of bliss.

Burgen wrote:

Valdar/Melan wrote:

Burgen wrote:

Valdar/Melan wrote: I can't believe that nobody has (or maybe they have, and I just havn't noticed it) made the point about how insanely paradoxal it is that everyone is going berserk that 12+ year old "children" could possibly be exposed to sexual content while it's, morally, perfectly acceptable to expose them to no-holds-barred violence and death.
Why do we need to shield children from sex and not torture, murder, terrorism, alcoholism, genocide and so forth? If I emote something along the lines of "Valdar jams his dagger into Melan's throat, grunting as he twists it, blood spurting out over his mask and armour." it is perfectly acceptable, but if I should emote something along the lines of "Valdar heatedly kisses Melan and presses his hand against his crotch." I have committed a great moral crime? And yes, I'm asking you to look past the fact that it's a Blizzard guideline and look at the moral/ethical question that is the reason for the guideline.

In my opinion, this mindset is an ugly remnant of the once so popular Media Effects Model with theories such as the Hypodermic Needle Theory and the Magic Bullet Theory. In most academical spheres, this model is largely dismissed as unscientific and out dated. However, in certain political spheres (like the American Christian Conservative Right) it is very popular. Not because this theoretical model has much merit to it, but it applies to their values.

Perhaps you should stop viewing 'children' as passive and realize that their viewing of the text (I.E this game) is far more active than you speculate.

Now, of course you shouldn't ERP in public channels. It is quite rude to other people RPing in that area, and it requires very little effort to create a party.

I'm sorry if my post was messy and my point sloppily made.

Except violence is something children engage in since infancy....throwing toys at their siblings being bullied and fighting back etc violence and death are something introduced to a living being from it's first days in the world....heck even when it's a baby they slap them....violence and death is something we can't seperate from children at all as they're perfectly familiar with it from their home lives or from their school lives.

As well as the fact every living creature and being is familiar with the concept of what death is.

As for the sex part that brings them to life well from my viewpoint and from experience when i was 11-12 when i was in school is that children should be learning of this stuff from an Adult whom is a proffessional in teaching those who are coming into their teenage years about what sex is....yes they have a good idea but really Children should learn in the proper time and place about sex and hear about if and of it in a proper adult professional setting....not from some pervert on world of warcraft who just wants to get his end away.

Are you seriously comparing the violence portrayed in RP to the kind of "violence" that children (in our part of the world) experience? When was the last time you saw a kid rip out the innards of another kid in the school yard? When was the last time a child dropped an atomic bomb (read: mana bomb) on a densely populated city? Now, I'm not saying that we -shouldn't- do violent RP, of course not. I'm remarking on the paradox of tabooing sex, but not violence. I'd rather we didn't taboo.

And yes, I agree that maybe children shouldn't engage in ERP themselves, and yes, I think that ERP should be 'kept behind shut doors' as it were, but there is a logical fallacy in condemning ERP and condoning violent RP. Similarly, it's a logical fallacy to assume that individuals who engage in ERP are A) perverts or B) doing it for sexual pleasure or both.

Assumption is the mother of all fuckups.

PS. Being a professional and being adult does not make you a non-pervert. Just putting it out there.

You've obviously never heard of History classes then y'know the ones where we learnt about the vikings,battle of hastings,World war 1,World war 2,The Celts,The Picts. I was learning about the violence of the vikings at age 7 and the celts and picts at age 9 coming into watching a video on the atrocities of sobibor at age 11-12 and seeing someone condemed to the gas chamber trying to escape to be then mauled by the attack dogs of the death camps guards.

Also these adult proffessionals i speak of are people like Doctors and Nurses and for them to be able to go into a school and teach children of this they need to pass certain checks and disclosures to be allowed onto premises.

You are misrepresenting my point here, Burgen. I never stated that kids are unaware of violence (just as they are not unaware of sex), I stated that more often than not in our part of the world, kids do not -experience- the same type of violence that is depicted in popular culture or in education. I think (this is an assumption, so I may very well be wrong here) that most kids at around the age of 12 are very much developing a sexuality.
Once again, I never said that kids arn't exposed to violent content in that age, on the contrary, that is very much what I'm saying. My point is that assuming that violence is something that we shouldn't keep from children while at the same time assuming that sex is terrible and a very real danger to the same children is wildly paradoxal and, in my opinion, moronic.

You see 12 year olds as active and aware enough to view violence and realize that 'nah, it's fine, it's only fiction', but they can't make that same distinction when sex is involved?

You don't think that the taboo against sex in the medias have something to do with a history of repression against sexuality from a dogmatic religion? You don't think it's something highly structurally integrated in society and its values? You don't think it's a manifestation of conservative ideology? I do. Why?
Well, because when you look at what violence and sex are, separate of the context of popular culture, you can see this:
Violence - Physical or psychological injury inflicted upon another human being. I am fairly confident that most people will agree that, in general, one should refrain from violence.
Sex: - A physical act of reproduction. In humanity's (and some other species') case, it is also done as a recreational activity.
If you look at what they are, and attempt to separate them from their moral connotations, would anybody contest the fact sex is of a less destructive nature? If not, why do we apply negative connotations to the one category which is less destructive?

You got me i was trolling the ERP'ers in that post really shouldn't have done that in hindsight i must admit. But besides that rather well sought out comeback.

It really isn't something you should be doing on WoW their are reasons Blizzard have policies against it.

You have an arsenal of other things in the game to be doing that are handed to you on a silver platter by the creators of the game you have multiple ways to flesh out and expand your character....but these things will be ignored by the ERP'ers for reasons i have stated previously such as them being Ignorant,Un-caring and Selfish they want to be allowed to do these things no matter whom it effects or even if it is against Blizzard policy so they choose to ignore the dangers that come with what they do.


Argue for ERP and against the Anti-ERP people all you wish but Blizzard is on a completely diffrent side from you ERP'ers you dabble with fire the policies are there not just for childrens protection but to protect you as well from any unfortunate circumstances involving angry parents.

On the one hand, I'd quote George RR Martin on this:

“I can describe an axe entering a human skull in great explicit detail and no one will blink twice at it. I provide a similar description, just as detailed, of a penis entering a vagina, and I get letters about it and people swearing off. To my mind this is kind of frustrating, it’s madness. Ultimately, in the history of [the] world, penises entering vaginas have given a lot of people a lot of pleasure; axes entering skulls, well, not so much.”

On the other, age is a concern. I'd generally be very wary of ERP situations -at all-, including privately, unless you can be 100% certain of the age of the person on the other end.

George R.R Martin has a very strange fantasy.

A book doesn't have to be grim, nor realistic to be filled include some gang rape scenes of kids.

Burgen. This is for you. Enjoy.

Your logical fallacy

Stop hiding behind the guidelines. Just because there's a rule against something does -not- mean that it's wrong. What is important is -why- that rule exists.
As they also note on that site "It's important to note that this fallacy should not be used to dismiss the claims of experts, or scientific consensus." And guess what? The scientific consensus around the Media Effects theory (of which you seem to be a follower) is very much that it has very little credibility as a scientific research model.

Now, as many others have pointed out, I don't think anyone in this thread has suggested that you should teach children about sex by shoving ERP in their faces. My point has, among other things, been that you should give children a little more cred as to what they can dismiss and what will harm them.

Another thing in your rhetoric that I find interesting is how you bunch ERPers together. ERP is, to the contrary of what you seem to believe, not something that RPers sit down and bond about over a cup of tea. They don't necessarily share opinions, agendas, preferences, values, religion and so forth ad infinitum. ERPers are not a 'group'. The -only- thing that unites them is that they roleplay out erotic scenarios, and that is pretty fucking general to start with. To make any other assumption about those individuals as a group, using only that as base knowledge, is incredibly ignorant.

ERP happens, that's a fact.... And there is nothing you can do about it. You can accept it, or go report everyone that does.

I still don't think ERPers are terrible RP'ers... they just have a need to be sexual as well which, in my opinion, is an OOC reason... not an IC one..

Argue it however you want Eselan you shouldn't be doing it in a game where you can expose children to it. That policy is there to protect them but also you from the wrath of angry parents if you want to flout it then fine you can play with the fire you WILL get burned eventually for what you do on WoW and that goes for the rest who do so.

I give children plenty of credit what im saying is they shouldn't learn about it from people like you on the off chance you start messing up or the other more blatant persons who engage in these erotic scenarios which their has been many of in the past.

What if I told you that Blizzard don't ban people if they try to keep it hidden?

Not trying to bring forth my opinion or anything, just a little note.

Gor'Thrak Frosthowl wrote:What if I told you that Blizzard don't ban people if they try to keep it hidden?

Not trying to bring forth my opinion or anything, just a little note.

That still doesn't make it right that just means their is a loophole.

Burgen wrote:Argue it however you want Eselan you shouldn't be doing it in a game where you can expose children to it. That policy is there to protect them but also you from the wrath of angry parents if you want to flout it then fine you can play with the fire you WILL get burned eventually for what you do on WoW and that goes for the rest who do so.

I give children plenty of credit what im saying is they shouldn't learn about it from people like you on the off chance you start messing up or the other more blatant persons who engage in these erotic scenarios which their has been many of in the past.

I'm pretty sure he's said (a few times now) that he isn't talking about people that do it openly, for the eyes of everyone around them. You seem to be continously retorting on the basis that he is.