Magical Laws In association with the Stormwind laws.

With Braiden Re-vamping the stormwind laws I for a while have been researching and creating magical laws. I'm at a point now where I think I've hit all the right marks however public opinion would be a great addition, so what do you as a community want in the magical laws?
I won't be posting up what I have so far as it's considered "Classified" but just throw what you think should be in them on this thread and If there's anything of good use I'll be sure to add it!

Rufias Nargrandus, Minister of magic.

Strict guidelines on the use of every type of magic.
Boundaries and such. Even on magic such as scrying. It should all require authorisation when over a certain limit imo. As a "For your own safety" sort of backing to it. If people don't agree with all magic, at least the ones considered extremely corruptive and evil.

If I think of any more I'll post something but this for me is the most necessary one. Those boundaries should be precise, so there can be no loopholes unless someone takes a while to work one out ICly.

The easiest way to avoid mention of a single dangerous thing is to mention that the Stormwind magi tower can and will interfere with any and all acts deemed unethical, corrupting or dangerous even if they are not specificly mentioned as illegal.

Considering the Kirin-Tor was to my knowledge in full support of the Alliance pre-Wrath of the Lich King, would their authority still be valued within the city of Stormwind and grant them similar powers to the Mage Tower by association? (I consider the majority of Dalaran to still be Alliance centric, given the nature of 'how' the Sunreavers were permitted entry.)

A harsher law on Druidic magic, namely the power to shape-shift within city limits. As it stands there appear to be no laws on this, and I find it a little... insane that no restrictions are set against individuals turning into sabertoothed cats; or wild bears.

Vaell wrote:Strict guidelines on the use of every type of magic.
Boundaries and such. Even on magic such as scrying. It should all require authorisation when over a certain limit imo. As a "For your own safety" sort of backing to it. If people don't agree with all magic, at least the ones considered extremely corruptive and evil.

If I think of any more I'll post something but this for me is the most necessary one. Those boundaries should be precise, so there can be no loopholes unless someone takes a while to work one out ICly.

Don't make the law too rigid or perfect. Look at the amount of RP that is spawning from the loophole we have now!
There should remain room for political debate and tragedy. We, the good guys, must have enough reason to argue something is wrong without always having enough of a case to demand executions.

The Kirin'Tor would have much harsher magical laws the the Alliance in general, the jurisdiction of these are Dalaran itself and members of the Kirin'Tor

Arenfel/Mikhael wrote:
A harsher law on Druidic magic, namely the power to shape-shift within city limits. As it stands there appear to be no laws on this, and I find it a little... insane that no restrictions are set against individuals turning into sabertoothed cats; or wild bears.

Anything committed whilst shape shifted would fall under some kind of law, I.E assault, murder, misuse or magic.

Remai D'Waltir wrote:The Kirin'Tor would have much harsher magical laws the the Alliance in general, the jurisdiction of these are Dalaran itself and members of the Kirin'Tor

No doubt! But perhaps it can include words that spawn debate such as "endangering the citizens" or "in the best interest of the Alliance".
This would offer a platform for conflict rather than a single possible conclusion: "Off with your head!!".

I like it, I'll see what I can do.

Jeanpierre/Ragnilde wrote:

Vaell wrote:Strict guidelines on the use of every type of magic.
Boundaries and such. Even on magic such as scrying. It should all require authorisation when over a certain limit imo. As a "For your own safety" sort of backing to it. If people don't agree with all magic, at least the ones considered extremely corruptive and evil.

If I think of any more I'll post something but this for me is the most necessary one. Those boundaries should be precise, so there can be no loopholes unless someone takes a while to work one out ICly.

Don't make the law too rigid or perfect. Look at the amount of RP that is spawning from the loophole we have now!
There should remain room for political debate and tragedy. We, the good guys, must have enough reason to argue something is wrong without always having enough of a case to demand executions.

I think you could generate twice as much with stricter laws set in place. It'll allow smarter characters to find a clever loophole or put them in a position where they must go through a few people to get what they need, manipulating them how they want. It opens up more doorways and includes more people to put greater restrictions on things.

Just as long as it doesn't rely on a perfect structure, it could be made to work. But to require more work to get started, might reduce creativity. In the end, we need a good balance wherein good preparations are well appreciated but not an absolute requirement OOC, even if they are IC.
Imagine a new roleplayer on the realm, vaguely familiar with the laws. He/She should be capable of getting some RP done without having to study the whole community to know who to ask permission from.

And in case that player makes a slip... We might want to be able to punish him/her, but not necessarily be forced to kill the character "by law".

You people and your silly laws!

*shakes fist*

Jeanpierre/Ragnilde wrote:Just as long as it doesn't rely on a perfect structure, it could be made to work. But to require more work to get started, might reduce creativity. In the end, we need a good balance wherein good preparations are well appreciated but not an absolute requirement OOC, even if they are IC.
Imagine a new roleplayer on the realm, vaguely familiar with the laws. He/She should be capable of getting some RP done without having to study the whole community to know who to ask permission from.

And in case that player makes a slip... We might want to be able to punish him/her, but not necessarily be forced to kill the character "by law".

Oh no, I agree. I think many of the laws are sort of common sense but I think magic could do with an overview as a lot of people get confused with what is good and what is bad. (As a side note, I think someone - DRUSTAI - should write a guide on the use of magic! So people know their limits and what can boost magic, what drains it, the consumption of mana etc... I see some people casting a fireball and taking their time to hurl it, where as others are launching meteors left right and center.)

I agree, i myself ask around for tips on magic even still. For now i generally keep it slow and balanced and make sense and keep boundaries.

Although right now i mostly use Rune magic for now which had a very long explanation on it's own even with the wiki and all.

Personally spells should focus kind of ingame manner, while being able to keep some creativity.

Like instant cast spells, cast time... But longer casts will actually do some damage while instants will be minor. Just an Example.

People should know magic is a complex thing but it should be kept simple, balanced in logic and fun.

Also stop trying to push it all on one person, there are loads of good magic lore knowing people who can work Together to make a guide.

I will copy my post from the other thread:

Drustai wrote:Oh, and another thing. On dark magic. The current laws for them are rather bad. For example, the whole 'tacking on' of shadow magic onto the fel magic law was pure laziness. It should have been its own separate law.


My suggestion would be to have an entire category on dark magic (or even just magic, period). Then, at least the three following categories:

Necromancy
Demonology
Shadow Magic, Other

The latter being any shadow magic that falls outside the boundaries of necromancy/fel.

Each section should include subsections on areas such as study (is it legal to study for the purpose of countering it? If so, who may conduct such studies? Etc), use (is it legal to use in certain circumstances? If so, by whom and for what purposes?), and so on.

You could, of course, list other, lesser irreputable or dangerous magicks, which would likewise have less restrictions but still require some manner of rules. Like blood magic, chronomancy, battle magic, etc.

Some other things that definitely need be mentioned. Divination and Enchantment. Both of these have the potential for severe "rights violations" (I know we don't have basic rights but you get what I mean). In both of these schools I recommend that using them on another person is illegal, despite their not being actual offensive magic. Though the main offending spells in these schools are under the element of shadow and thus would fall under Shadow Magic, Other, there are Div/Ench spells that are not so both schools should be mentioned on their own as well. (scrying, as Vaell mentioned, has great potential for abuse)

Basically, any magic of any school that can be used to attack or violate another person's person, physical property, mental property, and personal control should be restricted to authorized personnel only (in whatever definition 'authorized person' means in this case).

Also: Conjuring gold or other methods of payment should be illegal. As such conjured items would not only destroy the economy, but also fade into nothing in a few hours/days and thus rip off the seller, obviously using such should not be permitted.

Oh, laws for dangerous magical creatures, objects, and reagents.

siegmund wrote:Also stop trying to push it all on one person, there are loads of good magic lore knowing people who can work Together to make a guide.

I wouldn't trust any of the others! Besides I already have one in progress.

I was only pushing it on Drustai because tbh, I owe her a lot for her guide on playing a DK. I think her capability with making lore easily understandable and still drawing upon accurate references is second to none. Obviously, send suggestions and things you may know which she may not but it needs to be easily accessible, understandable and well structured which I trust Drustai to do!

Dunno Skarain was very helpful to me on magic, mostly Rune Magic, yet as you wish.

siegmund wrote:Dunno Skarain was very helpful to me on magic, mostly Rune Magic, yet as you wish.

Of course she was. I taught her.

Drustai wrote:

siegmund wrote:Dunno Skarain was very helpful to me on magic, mostly Rune Magic, yet as you wish.

Of course she was. I taught her.

She did.

Skarain wrote:

Drustai wrote:

siegmund wrote:Dunno Skarain was very helpful to me on magic, mostly Rune Magic, yet as you wish.

Of course she was. I taught her.

She did

D'awww , does that mean i'll be the teacher one day? *Group hug*

Anywho:

Yes i believe a guide on magic would be a great idea. But one thing remains people need to know about these things even new rpers.

So i suggest post it on The blizzard rp and blizzard defias brotherhood forums.... As should all rules/guides that we are planing to make also new post about this Forum on the blizz one.

And copy and paste it into an OOC Ghi book item. I know not everyone has it, but it'll help expand the guide's reach.

Braiden wrote:The easiest way to avoid mention of a single dangerous thing is to mention that the Stormwind magi tower can and will interfere with any and all acts deemed unethical, corrupting or dangerous even if they are not specificly mentioned as illegal.

I would say that members of the church and the guards who are strongly associated with the light should also be allowed to interfere with any acts that seem unethical, corrupting or dangerous seeing as it is a central focus on their beliefs and for them to ignore it would not only be morally wrong to them but may also be a direct violation of their oath/duty

What about permits?

Can you guys make a hole in the laws?

Atheramis/Chezz wrote:What about permits?

Can you guys make a hole in the laws?

Considering the recent incidents, I highly doubt that there will be any kind of permit. Both major Stormwind holy orders are zealously against any form of permission or allowance for such magicks to be used in the city to any degree, and thus it would likely be political suicide to implement them in the revised laws.

Officially because of these "bans" people are forced to rp outside of stormwind as well (Preferably in blue zones for now, depends) even if they live there.

Westfall for example has basically no stormwindian influence anymore (After the quests line).

So this can be counted as a Giant Loophole. It's relatively close to SW and no one will "wander" randomly while you train/learn/use dark spells