Re: Elder Scrolls... ONLINE!?

by **Drustai** Sat May 05, 2012 4:56 am

Coppersocket wrote:Question time: What is TES without modding? Not much. TES thrives on the modding community, the bare games are often actually very unbalanced and unfavourable to certain playstyles.

The mod sandbox is what MAKES TES the games they are. Without the mods, they're just not the same. Playing any of them on console is very, very wrong- and anyone who does plays a incomplete game, and misses out on so much goodies.

Oblivion is practically unplayable without modding, yes. Skyrim on the other hand is a great game even when played vanilla. About the only thing I could say I'd miss with an unmodded Skyrim is RealisticLighting. The rest I wouldn't care too much about.

by **Muzjhath** Sat May 05, 2012 7:36 am

Vaell does point at something very true on the other hand =P

by **Skarain** Sat May 05, 2012 7:53 am

This is just like em' all. I see it rising and coming down, just like ToR

by **Drustai** Sat May 05, 2012 8:50 am

Muzjhath wrote:Vaell does point at something very true on the other hand =P

He does, and I wasn't arguing against that. I've already said that I'm very disappointed with the direction they've went for the MMO. Right now it's just another stock fantasy MMO, not the immersive sandbox that TES games are supposed to be.

by **Melnerag** Sat May 05, 2012 8:57 am

I feel that too many companies are going MMORPG-way. Imho, Bethesda should first try and make MULTIPLAYER for Skyrim, with a system for modders/players to make own dungeons to explore etc etc. Then may be try small-scale persistent servers for those who want to host'em (a bit like NWN) and when that all works out, only THEN try MMO.

by **Lyniath** Sat May 05, 2012 9:42 am

Melnerag wrote:I feel that too many companies are going MMORPG-way. Imho, Bethesda should first try and make MULTIPLAYER for Skyrim, with a system for modders/players to make own dungeons to explore etc etc. Then may be try small-scale persistent servers for those who want to host'em (a bit like NWN) and when that all works out, only THEN try MMO.

^agree'd

by **Shaelyssa** Sat May 05, 2012 10:04 am

Errr honestly don't think it's going to be any good personally

The beauty of Skyrim was that it wasn't classbased, you could play in first shooter mode and it was pretty simple, a button for attack and a button for defence

by **Antistia** Sat May 05, 2012 10:18 am

I'm fine with these mechanics tbh. I've always liked the normal TES mechanics, don't get me wrong, I love those mechanics, but they're extremely hard to balance and have their own disadvantages.

But mostly, and this is what got me into WoW in the first place, I adore the lore of TES, it's awesome and has a whole lot of possibilities. Surely that compensates a bit? Wink

by **Drustai** Sat May 05, 2012 10:30 am

The lore of TES has never been the draw of the series, IMO. I actually consider it rather bland. It's always been the immersion that has drawn me in. The amazing sense of scale of the world. The exploration.

The first person and player housing stuff are the big things for me. I can deal with a class-based system, though I don't like it. But there's absolutely no justification at all for making it third person, and for not having such a key sandbox element as player housing.

by **Dharum** Sat May 05, 2012 10:41 am

Just a reminder that it is not really Bethsedas MMO, but Zenimax.
Zenimax owns Beth, and so they have no say at all if Zeni wishes to make a MMO out of the setting.

Zeni bought hero engine, hired old Mythic people etc. The MMO team does not really have anyone from Bethseda working on it.

by **Drustai** Sat May 05, 2012 10:48 am

Yeah, I read that. Hoping that Bethesda will still be producing single player game TES games so we can all avoid the silly MMO.

by **Gilran** Sat May 05, 2012 11:27 am

Of course they will. The good thing is are placing the story 1,000 years before Skyrim. Therefore, Bethesda can continue story from Skyrim's with the new TES while the MMO is placed in past.

by **Vaell** Sat May 05, 2012 11:27 am

I agree with Drustai. I find the story of TES fun when I'm playing it but hardly a memorable experiance. Of course, there are aspects of it I love and it is always fun to dive into their stories but if I'm truly honest, Skyrim had pretty basic stories. It just had lots of them. The lore is good, don't get me wrong, but nothing new and compelling. Yes, there will be partly nostalgia from Morrowind but nothing like LOTRO's Weathertop for example. WoW first appealed to me because it brought the story of the strategy games to life.

Also, it isn't actually developed by Bethesda!

by **Ixirar** Sat May 05, 2012 12:46 pm

Inb4 Medieval SWTOR with magic and dragons... Oh wait.

No, this is gonna fail, really really bad. They can't deliver this one, not a chance.

I really really wanted COOP Multiplayer for TES, but an MMO is going to fail.

by **Chase - Esou** Sat May 05, 2012 1:07 pm

Coppersocket wrote:Question time: What is TES without modding? Not much. TES thrives on the modding community, the bare games are often actually very unbalanced and unfavourable to certain playstyles.

The mod sandbox is what MAKES TES the games they are. Without the mods, they're just not the same. Playing any of them on console is very, very wrong- and anyone who does plays a incomplete game, and misses out on so much goodies.

This, so many times over. Modders are pretty much required in order to balance and add content to the game.

The mmo will be a generic pile of wank.

by **Velynia** Sat May 05, 2012 2:39 pm

Really, I don't think the Elder Scrolls can work as an MMO. It just can't offer the same amount of immersion and detail as the singleplayer games, which is the main hook for me.
I just hope they continue the regular franchise, and I'll stay far away from this.

by **Drustai** Sat May 05, 2012 2:58 pm

It could work, but it'd require going back on all of the "developments" made in MMOs over the last decade. They are on the right track with removing hubs and re-adding world dungeons, but on its own that is not enough.

EQ1 is was the definitive example of that style of gameplay in an MMO (though it's been ruined over the years). It was a wide-open world, ripe for exploration and adventure. You could go where ever and do whatever. If you wanted to do quests in Qeynos instead of Freeport, you could. If you were a dark elf that wanted to overcome factional hatred from high elves, you could do it. Hell, wood elves could even become friendly with Crushbone Orcs (an enemy NPC faction that they hated) if they so desired.

It was first person, with environments on a massive scale. Traveling from one end of a continent to the other was something you planned in advance, made preparations for, and then spent the greater part of a day (or a week, depending on your pacing) to undertake (until they added portals everywhere in later expansions).

EQ1 was the king of exploration and immersion in the MMO world, despite its dated graphics. No one held your hand.

That is what a TES MMO would need to evoke.

by **Magaskawee/Anaei** Sat May 05, 2012 3:44 pm

Dharum wrote:Just a reminder that it is not really Bethsedas MMO, but Zenimax.
Zenimax owns Beth, and so they have no say at all if Zeni wishes to make a MMO out of the setting.

Zeni bought hero engine, hired old Mythic people etc. The MMO team does not really have anyone from Bethseda working on it.

I want my Fallout MMO .. Sad

by **Morinth** Sat May 05, 2012 4:19 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:

I want my Fallout MMO ..

by **Lyniath** Sat May 05, 2012 4:26 pm

Drustai wrote:It could work, but it'd require going back on all of the "developments" made in MMOs over the last decade. They are on the right track with removing hubs and re-adding world dungeons, but on its own that is not enough.

EQ1 is was the definitive example of that style of gameplay in an MMO (though it's been ruined over the years). It was a wide-open world, ripe for exploration and adventure. You could go where ever and do whatever. If you wanted to do quests in Qeynos instead of Freeport, you could. If you were a dark elf that wanted to overcome factional hatred from high elves, you could do it. Hell, wood elves could even become friendly with Crushbone Orcs (an enemy NPC faction that they hated) if they so desired.

It was first person, with environments on a massive scale. Traveling from one end of a continent to the other was something you planned in advance, made preparations for, and then spent the greater part of a day (or a week, depending on your pacing) to undertake (until they added portals everywhere in later expansions).

EQ1 was the king of exploration and immersion in the MMO world, despite its dated graphics. No one held your hand.

That is what a TES MMO would need to evoke.

This a million times.
I hate in MMOs when everyone is just focussed in one place, since they can go wherever they need in a heartbeat and get back instantly, spending the rest of their spare time in the "big city" where everything is.
But mostly, I love exploring more than anything else in games, and when you can skip continents in moments it gets boring. TES games always had that sense of scale, and an MMO would have to stick to that or frankly, it would be abandoning the main draw of Bethesda's games - the sense of scale and immersion

by **Dharum** Sat May 05, 2012 5:38 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Dharum wrote:Just a reminder that it is not really Bethsedas MMO, but Zenimax.
Zenimax owns Beth, and so they have no say at all if Zeni wishes to make a MMO out of the setting.

Zeni bought hero engine, hired old Mythic people etc. The MMO team does not really have anyone from Bethseda working on it.

I want my Fallout MMO ..

The good thing about Zeni doing Elders Scroll MMO is exactly the fact that atleast they are not working on Fallout MMO.

I don't want to see them destroy that any further :<
Imagine a basic cookie-cutter MMORPG fallout with Hero engine that has been dumbed down and cazualised of everything that makes Fallout :<

by **Muzjhath** Sat May 05, 2012 5:43 pm

Fallout MMO. I can see it now.
Almost everyone going for being able to use a sniper and headshots everywhere.

by **Vaell** Sat May 05, 2012 5:48 pm

You guys do realise Fallout MMO is already in the process of being made?!

by **Velynia** Sat May 05, 2012 6:14 pm

Really, I don't think a Fallout MMO would work either. I think the sense of a ruined, apocalyptic world would be lost with a million or so players running about. It would wholly ruin the atmosphere and sense of a desolate, ravaged land. Just my opinion, however.

by **Kristeas Sunbinder** Sat May 05, 2012 7:11 pm

Velynia wrote:Really, I don't think a Fallout MMO would work either. I think the sense of a ruined, apocalyptic world would be lost with a million or so players running about. It would wholly ruin the atmosphere and sense of a desolate, ravaged land. Just my opinion, however.

They could try a GW route with instances (either per player/party or one for every 100 players or so) outside villages/hubs.

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