"Guide to the Horde on Defias?"

Posted on the Official Forums:

Due to recent events that happened yesterday, in which a mere 3-4 people (Zaelsino included) managed to run through Stormwind and cause mass-disruption, killing both the Archbishop of the Cathedral and the head of the Mages Tower various times, for about 10-20 minutes without dying once, I am once again convinced that it would be within my best interests to race-change to Horde.

The people of the Alliance mostly stood Idle as the Horde released their wrath upon the Cathedral Square and Mage District of Stormwind - infact, even when asked about why he didn't fight against the Horde, a <Stormwind Elite Guard> member stated "Why should I fight a losing battle?". It was only a mere 3 or 4 people, and that made me realise that long ago, when we did that Southshore RP-PvP battle where the Horde had gathered 2 raid groups while the Alliance had only managed one, that was not simply "coincidence" as I was told at the time. Twice thoughout the day, with a mere few hours separating the two times, various people (including myself) had tried to rally a group for the Achievement "For the Alliance!" - but to no avail. This, people of Defias, is the reason I plan to faction change.

With that ranting over and done with, I call upon the Horde to give me a somewhat accurate description of what differs RP and PvP-wise on the Horde side. I plan to race-change to Blood Elf, but have slight thoughts about Forsaken. In the end, however, constant persuasion of which of those two races to choose will merely be ignored - as I will decide upon my own opinion.

Thank you,
Etular.

Since I got not many answers from the official forum, I decided to post here. My the way, I plan to race-change into a Blood Elf Techno-Mage (Warlock Class).

The Kul Tiras thing hasn't worked out either, I take. :-)

Gnash wrote:The Kul Tiras thing hasn't worked out either, I take. :-)

Unattempted, to be more accurate. Seeing the lack of enthusiasm the Alliance has for PvP and the criticism I was given for the idea, I have a pretty good idea it would fail.

The topic in the official db forum is just awesome.

Etular wrote:Since I got not many answers from the official forum, I decided to post here. My the way, I plan to race-change into a Blood Elf Techno-Mage (Warlock Class).

95% of the people here are also in the Defias forums (and that's the most favouring guess to your case, I'd say closer to 100%). I'd understand it if you posted here cause you didn't want to post on the realm forums, but posting here the same thing AFTER you posted on realm forums, is just spamming tbh.

The Alliance has many good PvPers;

Problem is, they're always online one at a time. True story about people not doing anything about the horde running about, though. A couple of times I was the only one who charged and actually killed horde at the Cathedral Square, surrounded by level 80 people who couldn't be arsed to change from their outdated epix & kick some ass.

So much for staying in character, imo.

Nayan wrote:

Etular wrote:Since I got not many answers from the official forum, I decided to post here. My the way, I plan to race-change into a Blood Elf Techno-Mage (Warlock Class).

95% of the people here are also in the Defias forums (and that's the most favouring guess to your case, I'd say closer to 100%). I'd understand it if you posted here cause you didn't want to post on the realm forums, but posting here the same thing AFTER you posted on realm forums, is just spamming tbh.

I'm posting here, purely, due to this being an RP and Defias Brotherhood forum (and this is, needless to say, an RP Problem on Defias Brotherhood realm) and due to a lack of a decent reply on the official forums, quite honestly, means I have nowhere else to turn. Unlike the official forums, where they can go drastically off-topic, these forums both cater to RP matters and are moderated to help the original poster find his answer without it going too far off-topic.

If it would help my case any further, I would happily delete my original post from the topic in the official forums.

The grass isn't greener.

Hordies will happily blueshield and ignore or spam /rofl emotes at the few allies who swings by horde capitals.

1. Deleting your realm forums topic would change absolutely nothing, as it's evident I was referring to intentions, not to the absolute fact the post exists in two forums, I couldn't care less about that.

2. You went as offtopic as anyone else, in that thread. Pointing fingers is bad when your nest is dirty.

3. Your realm forums thread had more than enough information, not sure exactly what you were expecting to see posted there.

4. Here's my reply here too, then.

[Alliance account]: /cheer
[Horde account]: /facepalm

And stay in Silvermoon please.

...not sure how different you expect responses to be here than there, but hey, if it makes you happy...

there is no need to be so rude and harsh, Nayan. If reading the topic makes your eyes bleed and hands shake with anger, you can simply leave it be.

No offense intented at all, but if a threat annoys you, leaving it alone is the best you can do. In extreeme cases, you can take it into PMs with mods/the poster.

Sorry for going offtopic aswell, Etular. My actual reply would be that I think you overcomplicate RP too much. There is no need to write long posts or do deep thinking upon RP, just get out there and make it happend. But I've told you this in several of your threats already

Someone posts a thread in realm forums, asking a question. In realm forums there are groups A (RP'ers) and B (OOC'ers) who are members.

That someone posts the same thread in other forums, asking the same question. In those other forums, the members are of group A (RP'ers).

Group A has all access to the first thread to reply. The second thread is useless.

If you find that rude, so be it, I don't. I find it logic.

Don't mix my personal view of being happy for alliance's sake that he's swapping and facepalming for horde's sake, with the fact I find the thread useless, that's two completely different things.

Also, keep in mind, that if everyone posted their realm forums thread here, this forum would be a mess, a pain and a bad realm forums copy. Which is "not working as intended", if you ask me Thank you for the suggestion to PM a mod, but I am one.

Nayan baby, your replies are riddled with personal dislike. :p I see your point, but you could have brought it a bit nicer. And Etular's point stands as well. The replies he got on the realm forums were mostly from non-RPers or people trying to troll. Then I'd take it up here too if I had an RP-related announcement or question.

Anyway, trying to remain remotely on topic: I used to RP a human engineer-warlock. Or rather, a fel-engineer drawing inspiration from the Mo'arg. Pretty awesome to RP as well. However, I doubt belves would suit an RP like that, since belves are hardly a technologic race. I'd find an undead, or if you wait untill Cataclysm, a goblin way more convincing.

As for you getting bored of alliance RP; find some people to RP with. You probably know a few names from this forum now, poke them ingame. OR join a guild that would fit you, like the Vanguard of Duskwood. Take some initiative. It's not in a person's nature to invite someone they hardly know to do stuff, so you've got to take matters into your own hands!

Good luckses.

............who are you and what did you do to Archal?

And yeah, s'pose I could have. Doesn't retract the essence, though.

Ug by' Chu'k, ug nom' da yug'! Raoo! Als'o, ug by hyl'py dy's da'y.

Nah, but he's trying, and I concider it my gallant quest to guide the young lad into greener pastures, or until he starts to bore me. >

I'd echo what Archal said.

Sad to see what the Alliance has come to though. But then it's always been kinda how the sides have set up. From my experience Alliance players tend to prioritize PvE while the Hordies go for PvP. Though I currently don't play, it makes me kinda miss the earlier days on DB with Faye/Faurh/Frog/Eain and Co. Nostalgia, I guess.

That said, sad to see you leaving the Alliance, I liked the creativity and ambition of your ideas, even if some were out of reach. Even if you're met with resistance it's always good to try new things and keep thinking of improvements. Mordazan also has a point though, sometimes casual RP is by far the best.

Wow, I hope this didn't get too convoluted.

Ataris wrote:I'd echo what Archal said.

Sad to see what the Alliance has come to though. But then it's always been kinda how the sides have set up. From my experience Alliance players tend to prioritize PvE while the Hordies go for PvP.

Which is kinda ironic, as the top PvE guilds are on horde side, save Revelations. I always thought RP was way more active and organized on alliance side. Where horde mostly has factions aside the horde (SGE, elitist belves, CoS to some extent), Alliance has factions working together.

Anyway, what I'd do, is settle with your Fel-engineer idea, and stick with it. The longer you stick with an idea, the better you get aquainted with it yourself, the better it gets for others. The important thing here, for your enjoyment, is get it out there. Stop theorycrafting and start playing out your character. After you played him out a couple of times, you evaluate and shape and shave him a bit more.

Its the same on horde side people just sit there and continueing what they was doing, there will always be people who will cower behind the blue shield thingy. As for Horde RP I would say you need to be in certain guilds to get any or know certain people. Also people only seem to join in defending the city when they know they have a chance of winning personally I go and try to help Stormwind when ever its in trouble but cant always be around and there is only so much one person can do.

Well either way its your own choice but personally I dont think you will find that there is much differance between city raiding defence factor and I would say RP is more alive on alliance side then horde after playing on both.

Stop theorycrafting and start playing out your character.

That.

One of the most creative chars I've ever met, was not some Warlord, not some fearsome Mage, not some Necromancer, not some Prince or Politician or Veteran Warrior.

It was dwarf shoe-polisher.

He'd just walk around Stormwind, advertising his services IC'ly. No forum threads, no ooc whispers, no huge plans.. just.. RPing his char, walking around, advertising his services, performing, even receiving tips in real currency.

I can't tell you how much better I felt seeing him walk around and ROLEPLAYING than having to see 534563456345452342345235 "amazing" chars checking who is the most amazing. That little dwarf was the most amazing, in his simplicity.

PS: If anyone remembers that dwarf and knows who it was, would you please pass him my thanks for making Stormwind RP somewhat better?

Nayan wrote:

Stop theorycrafting and start playing out your character.

That.

One of the most creative chars I've ever met, was not some Warlord, not some fearsome Mage, not some Necromancer, not some Prince or Politician or Veteran Warrior.

It was dwarf shoe-polisher.

He'd just walk around Stormwind, advertising his services IC'ly. No forum threads, no ooc whispers, no huge plans.. just.. RPing his char, walking around, advertising his services, performing, even receiving tips in real currency.

Oh I remember him! cant think of the name though T_T

But yea simpe characters are the best there is no need for *insert super heroic complicated background here*

Nayan wrote:
It was dwarf shoe-polisher.

He'd just walk around Stormwind, advertising his services IC'ly. No forum threads, no ooc whispers, no huge plans.. just.. RPing his char, walking around, advertising his services, performing, even receiving tips in real currency.

I can't tell you how much better I felt seeing him walk around and ROLEPLAYING than having to see 534563456345452342345235 "amazing" chars checking who is the most amazing. That little dwarf was the most amazing, in his simplicity.

PS: If anyone remembers that dwarf and knows who it was, would you please pass him my thanks for making Stormwind RP somewhat better?

Same! He polished my hooves <3 I can't remember the name though

Derailers! All of you!

Archal/Hazrah/Vaneyk wrote:

Ataris wrote:I'd echo what Archal said.

Sad to see what the Alliance has come to though. But then it's always been kinda how the sides have set up. From my experience Alliance players tend to prioritize PvE while the Hordies go for PvP.

Which is kinda ironic, as the top PvE guilds are on horde side, save Revelations. I always thought RP was way more active and organized on alliance side. Where horde mostly has factions aside the horde (SGE, elitist belves, CoS to some extent), Alliance has factions working together.

Yeah, times have changed I guess. Most of my played time is from Vanilla and BC. WotLK was mediocre imo, Ulduar was great but the rest has been bleh, leveling excepted.

When it comes to RP I have only played Alliance on DB, Horde on other servers, but I find that it has a lot to do with the cultural differences in the races. Orcs aren't as much about holding political meetings as the humans for instance. As for working together or not, I do not have enough insight to judge.

Sorry for the off-topicness btw.

Etular wrote:Posted on the Official Forums:

Due to recent events that happened yesterday, in which a mere 3-4 people (Zaelsino included) managed to run through Stormwind and cause mass-disruption, killing both the Archbishop of the Cathedral and the head of the Mages Tower various times, for about 10-20 minutes without dying once, I am once again convinced that it would be within my best interests to race-change to Horde.

The people of the Alliance mostly stood Idle as the Horde released their wrath upon the Cathedral Square and Mage District of Stormwind - infact, even when asked about why he didn't fight against the Horde, a <Stormwind Elite Guard> member stated "Why should I fight a losing battle?". It was only a mere 3 or 4 people, and that made me realise that long ago, when we did that Southshore RP-PvP battle where the Horde had gathered 2 raid groups while the Alliance had only managed one, that was not simply "coincidence" as I was told at the time. Twice thoughout the day, with a mere few hours separating the two times, various people (including myself) had tried to rally a group for the Achievement "For the Alliance!" - but to no avail. This, people of Defias, is the reason I plan to faction change.

With that ranting over and done with, I call upon the Horde to give me a somewhat accurate description of what differs RP and PvP-wise on the Horde side. I plan to race-change to Blood Elf, but have slight thoughts about Forsaken. In the end, however, constant persuasion of which of those two races to choose will merely be ignored - as I will decide upon my own opinion.

Thank you,
Etular.

Since I got not many answers from the official forum, I decided to post here. My the way, I plan to race-change into a Blood Elf Techno-Mage (Warlock Class).

I havn't read the replies that came after so excuse me if I repeat anything.

Etular. I personally think you're taking things a bit far here though I do agree the alliance RP community do tend to lazy around when it comes to PVP in their cities during RP. I am a bit conflicted on that myself as in the end while it's a bit silly to ignore the going on's sometimes, you also have to take into consideration those people are paying customers to the game too and do not wish to engage in W-PVP in that sense. I say fair game to them.

It's true the horde are more PVP centric than we alliance but at the end of the day. Do you really care over some W-PVP Etular?

Talking about that achievement though, isn't that the one for the bear mount? You do know why less people gather for that one right? Most of the people did it over the span of the previous year.

Mordazan wrote:
Sorry for going offtopic aswell, Etular. My actual reply would be that I think you overcomplicate RP too much. There is no need to write long posts or do deep thinking upon RP, just get out there and make it happend. But I've told you this in several of your threats already

True, true. The problem for me, is that I'm both a pessimist and perfectionist. For me, if something isn't fully planned out, it will most likely go wrong and, unless I spend proper time on the project (planning it out to every last detail), it will likely fail. Then, when it fails anyway, I blame myself for having spent so much time on an idea and society for not knowing a well-planned idea, even if it were to hit them in the face.

Archal/Hazrah/Vaneyk wrote:
Anyway, trying to remain remotely on topic: I used to RP a human engineer-warlock. Or rather, a fel-engineer drawing inspiration from the Mo'arg. Pretty awesome to RP as well. However, I doubt belves would suit an RP like that, since belves are hardly a technologic race. I'd find an undead, or if you wait untill Cataclysm, a goblin way more convincing.

Then what are Belves more suited to? Quite honestly, the idea of a techno-mage was just a way of me trying to incorporate my Engineering profession into RP. I am more focused on the Blood Elf race than the techno-mage idea. However, forsaken aside, Belves seem the most technologically-inclined than the rest of the Horde.

Archal/Hazrah/Vaneyk wrote:
As for you getting bored of alliance RP; find some people to RP with. You probably know a few names from this forum now, poke them ingame. OR join a guild that would fit you, like the Vanguard of Duskwood. Take some initiative. It's not in a person's nature to invite someone they hardly know to do stuff, so you've got to take matters into your own hands

I've tried. Dark Sphere, for example. there was a similar evil guild on AD that a similar thing happened to. More accurately, after joining a guild that suits my character, I get a small urge to create a Guild of my own design. I ignore it as it grows, and grows, and grows. I keep ignoring it but, in doing so, I end up unintentionally coming out with some form of foolhardy comment OOCly that gets me kicked. I was kicked from TDS by Zerafias for doing so, and I was kicked from that guild on AD for doing so (as well as getting ICly tortured on AD for having reported them to the guards shortly after . It wasn't metagaming, as my character had already planned to do so anyway. My character may be, alignment-wise, "evil" - but he's far more lawful and law-abiding, making him different from the average cultist).

Ataris wrote:I'd echo what Archal said.

Sad to see what the Alliance has come to though. But then it's always been kinda how the sides have set up. From my experience Alliance players tend to prioritize PvE while the Hordies go for PvP. Though I currently don't play, it makes me kinda miss the earlier days on DB with Faye/Faurh/Frog/Eain and Co. Nostalgia, I guess.

true. 'Tis a sad day when three people can cause havok in Stormwind - barely hindered.

Ataris wrote:
That said, sad to see you leaving the Alliance, I liked the creativity and ambition of your ideas, even if some were out of reach. Even if you're met with resistance it's always good to try new things and keep thinking of improvements. Mordazan also has a point though, sometimes casual RP is by far the best.

Thanks, and true - sometimes casual RP is by far the best. As for my guild ideas, someone can only be told "No" so many times before they begin to wonder "What if they're right? What if I am a failure?". Quite honestly, it was around that point that I'd stopped RPing altogether. I had been kicked from TDS, Vanguard of Duskwood had just opened and, originally, I merely thought it as a "good" guild. When I realised it was an off-shoot of TDS, I merely assumed I would not be allowed in due to my former misbehaviour and, if I was, the urge would cause me to misbehave yet again. My guild ideas and inspiration had both ran out due to criticism and lack of ideas. Basically, by then, I had just gave up. Now people are saying I should RP more. It's between RPing in a guild and eventually getting kicked, creating a guild that would get criticised and fail, spend most of my time in Cathedral Square or not RP at all.

In the end, I saw no point in further wasting people's time with my ideas, terrible attempts at RP or unintentionally offences that would most likely be typed. I looked at my Character Backstory, then, and saw it as very flawed. I planned to change it to Kul Tiras, but when I got the slightest criticism for that, I just put it off. This is where I am now.

Ataris wrote:
Wow, I hope this didn't get too convoluted.

If anything, my points are far more convoluted. Don't worry about it.

Veia wrote:Its the same on horde side people just sit there and continueing what they was doing, there will always be people who will cower behind the blue shield thingy. As for Horde RP I would say you need to be in certain guilds to get any or know certain people. Also people only seem to join in defending the city when they know they have a chance of winning personally I go and try to help Stormwind when ever its in trouble but cant always be around and there is only so much one person can do.

I don't mind about guild RP that much. the only successful RP guild i have been in, in WoW, was The Dwarven District Squad on DMF realm. The only reason it had succeeded there was because the Guild Leader was a psychologist. However, with every good there was a bad: One member has a psychological problem (Syndrome, perhaps?) that caused him to hate my guts. Apparently, his problem clashed rather majorly with my Aspergers. Infact, I remember when I was in my level 30's - having gained the Arena title by using my gnomish size to my advantage. He was infuriated. I was corpse-camped for ages...

Anyway, erm, yes. I don't mind Guild RP that much. I loved the IC Guild chat that the Squad gave. in the end, I left DMF purely for seeking "greener pastures", so to speak. I went searching for higher-quality/quantity RP on a "better" RP realm. As for the PvP, I can imagine no-one defending if the Horde had sent a whole raid on Stormwind, but 3 people is (in my eyes) just too darn embarrassing. I was constantly saying on Trade and LocalDefense - "Come on! It's just 3 people! 3 people killing our Archbishop and boss in the Mages Tower!". Few people actually fought. By "few", I mean only 1 or 2 level 80's - which were no challenge for the Two DPSes and a Healer.

Veia wrote:
Well either way its your own choice but personally I dont think you will find that there is much differance between city raiding defence factor and I would say RP is more alive on alliance side then horde after playing on both.

That is, quite frankly, my worry. I've test-trialled Horde and found quite a bit of random RP - but is that a rarity? Is the Horde actually any better at PvP than Alliance, or is it just a pigment of my imagination? Is the RP really only "Guild Based"? Would I be able to find any friends on Horde-side?

Nayan wrote:
I can't tell you how much better I felt seeing him walk around and ROLEPLAYING than having to see 534563456345452342345235 "amazing" chars checking who is the most amazing. That little dwarf was the most amazing, in his simplicity.

On the one hand, I don't necessarily want a character that's too "weak", as I feel I could get bored of him rather quickly. Then again, I don't want someone too strong for the same reason, hence, I create a character of mediocre combat value. I also want a character that has shares some of my character traits (Arrogant, vain, intellectual, more logical than practical, tactical/strategic, cunning etc.) and traits I seek to be (Self-centred, cold, unfeeling/uncaring of others, heartless (but not cruel or sadistic) etc.), but (for me) it's hard to combine all those traits into one character and roleplay him efficiently. Either that, or I do roleplay him efficiently and I've gave up due to constant criticism.

Ovelia "Snow" Adair wrote:

I havn't read the replies that came after so excuse me if I repeat anything.

Etular. I personally think you're taking things a bit far here though I do agree the alliance RP community do tend to lazy around when it comes to PVP in their cities during RP. I am a bit conflicted on that myself as in the end while it's a bit silly to ignore the going on's sometimes, you also have to take into consideration those people are paying customers to the game too and do not wish to engage in W-PVP in that sense. I say fair game to them.

True. I, myself, am having second thoughts at whether this is too far or not. the problem here is, mostly, that I chose an RP-PvP realm because I expected the people to, mostly, both RP and PvP. I've put up with the lack of PvP, but when it comes to 3 people dominating NPCs, I just cannot help but see the logic in why no-one takes a stand against 3 people. This, and the lack of anyone willing to retaliate against them, has made me really wonder whether I'd be best on Alliance or Horde. For myself, whom (at maximum level) plans to arena and does alot of BG Levelling/World PvP at the moment, I'm beginning to wonder whether or not my being Alliance may affect my chances of finding a decent/suitable Arena partner or the PvP events that may happen. Overall, I find myself RPing less and less (to the point of, now, where I'm doing none at all. Above I have explained why), yet PvPing more and more.

Ovelia "Snow" Adair wrote:
It's true the horde are more PVP centric than we alliance but at the end of the day. Do you really care over some W-PVP Etular?

If we can't defend our capital city from 3 people and could barely gather 10 members in an attempt to get revenge or kill Horde Bosses (which was attempted twice throughout the day), the lack of action (in my eyes) does matter rather drastically. I knew PvP was low, but never expected it to be this low. I'm told to "do something about it", but how can one person change the mindset of an entire realm? How can that one person defy the odds various times to get PvP gear to even have a chance of doing so (well, I have defied odds many a time IRL, but still...)? If I were to succeed, I would be possibly the biggest hero - I'd either be loved, or hated. If I fail, my morale sinks to an all-time low and I give up completely. I'm not willing to take the risk.

Ovelia "Snow" Adair wrote:
Talking about that achievement though, isn't that the one for the bear mount? You do know why less people gather for that one right? Most of the people did it over the span of the previous year.

Still, I see alot of people who already have the Achievement doing it purely to see the opposite faction cities in greater depth and detail without having to create a new character and in a fun, exciting way.

I took a look at the engineering place in SMC and i think those guys stole it from some goblins and some forsaken. And even then forsaken are more alchemists >.>
While there's nothing wrong with being a technomage, i'm can't help but wonder what the blood mages think about that.


Also:
The best laid plans never survive contact with the enemy.