OOC Letter to Stormwind Council discussion

Saevir wrote:
Wasn't it mentioned somewhere that Mandui did not use the steed within Stormwind itself, or did I just misread something somewhere?

I've seen her use it in Stormwind plenty of times, so I don't know where that comment came from.

Wow.. this thread got big, I posted what inquiry because I thought shadow and fel magic and necromancy is against the law in Stormwind, and if someone were to use it they'd be dog piled or atleast discriminated by the guards / populaton.

Wow.. this thread got big

All it takes is for one loudmouthed git to yell Witch and the rest of the blood hungry mob swiftly joins in to wave their pitchforks and torches.

May I point out a few things here?

It was mentioned "this isn't the 21st century, it's the World of Warcraft!" which is correct, yet terribly misinterpreted. See, the World of Warcraft is NOT the Middle Ages. In the Middle Ages they had witch-hunts, Inquisition, fanatics, all fair and square, but in the World of Warcraft magic is the norm, not the exception. Noone in their right minds would "burn a witch", in fact major lore figures are dabbling with it, Jaina Proudmoore, the Kirin Tor, Medivh, etc etc.

I know what you'll say, that "shadow is not the same as fire or frost", yes, indeed it isn't, it's merely another school of magic. Peasants would not "hunt" magic users, they live with them, the same way they live with bakers and blacksmiths and stableboys. "Shadow magic" is not "evil magic", you're looking for "Necromancy" here, for "Unholy magic", but not Shadow.

In fact, Elune herself has a dual nature. Shadow is half of it. It's part of the world, nothing that could even remotely be seen as "heresy".

Warlocks are "suspicious" for their meddling with DEMONIC summonings, Mages are "suspicious" (to specific societies, such as Night Elves) due to what happened with the Highborne and their careless use of it, but... Shadow? Really? It was never really frowned upon.

Another thing I'd like to point out is, I've had FIERCE IC conflicts with people, and in whispers we were all in good fun. Orfide, Jondalar, ask them. Why was it different? Cause we ooc'ly talked, we knew it was purely IC.

I'm sorry, no, World of Warcraft is not "Middle Ages", it doesn't take "one git to yell Witch and the blood hungry mob swiftly joins in to wave their pitchforks and torches". It'd be like expecting the mob in Middle Ages to hunt down with pitchforks and torches the... village Blacksmith because someone yelled "Blacksmith!".

My own two pence.

I'm sorry, no, World of Warcraft is not "Middle Ages", it doesn't take "one git to yell Witch and the blood hungry mob swiftly joins in to wave their pitchforks and torches". It'd be like expecting the mob in Middle Ages to hunt down with pitchforks and torches the... village Blacksmith because someone yelled "Blacksmith

I see you missed out the meaning behind it, as you took it too literal and not reading between the lines.

- Cookie for you Lucifer!

I actually have to agree with Nayen on those points...Also I never saw WoW as middle ages either, I saw it more "steampunk" more than ever lately.

I have always seen WoW as online dating game.

Nayan wrote:
I know what you'll say, that "shadow is not the same as fire or frost", yes, indeed it isn't, it's merely another school of magic. Peasants would not "hunt" magic users, they live with them, the same way they live with bakers and blacksmiths and stableboys. "Shadow magic" is not "evil magic", you're looking for "Necromancy" here, for "Unholy magic", but not Shadow.

In fact, Elune herself has a dual nature. Shadow is half of it. It's part of the world, nothing that could even remotely be seen as "heresy".

I hope this is heard this time, I've been trying to make people realize this for years -_-

Correct, but is it now frowned upon?

Also, isn't technically owning a skeleton horse riding through Stormwind be Necromancy? And a demonic horse being ridden by a warlock Fel magic, being a demonic horse..

Tasjin wrote:Correct, but is it now frowned upon?

Also, isn't technically owning a skeleton horse riding through Stormwind be Necromancy? And a demonic horse being ridden by a warlock Fel magic, being a demonic horse..

I haven't ridden the death charger within the city for over 7 months, ICly not at least....like I already said. Repeating, repeating, repeating. Nothing new to say so I'll just stop posting

From what I've gathered there's no real stance on what is tolerated and what is not in lore...

Some lore sources say that warlocks are tolerated, yet the Ironforge cabal claims it had to shift most of it's organisation to stormwind for fear of being noticed and the Stormwind cabal sends you to kill a noble who tries to expose them to the King.

Some lore states that Shadow is the manifestation of evil... some say it's part of the Lights dual nature (and thus completely natural).

Some lore says that shadowpriests are tolerated, yet no npc order that's clearly good seems to employ even a single one of them. But almost all evil (or semi-evil) ones seem to do so.

I think this is really part of the problem... there's just as much lore that supports inquisition-esque acts against shadow/fel as there is lore that contradicts that and says that they're a welcome part of the factions. There's really no knowing which is right and which isn't...

I haven't ridden the death charger within the city for over 7 months

I wasn't refering to you, I was refer to others in general who would do such a thing ^^

I

know what you'll say, that "shadow is not the same as fire or frost", yes, indeed it isn't, it's merely another school of magic. Peasants would not "hunt" magic users, they live with them, the same way they live with bakers and blacksmiths and stableboys. "Shadow magic" is not "evil magic", you're looking for "Necromancy" here, for "Unholy magic", but not Shadow.

In fact, Elune herself has a dual nature. Shadow is half of it. It's part of the world, nothing that could even remotely be seen as "heresy"

.


Wrong, Shadow Magic is the destructive and pure form of Arcane, alas also Fel Magic, Necromancy etc are all a subcathegory of Fel Magic, and this is the most addicting and purest forms of destructive and physically manipulative magic and energy.

It corrupts as chaos and disorder is it's pure form, negativity etc.


The Elves magic is not the same, for they're empowered by the moon, It's more Nature magic than anything else, S'pose with a touch of the Arcane, but in a culture of the Elves and especially the Draenei, the Shadow is frowned upon, the Draenei if anyone have experienced it's corruption and results afflicted upon the outland and their race in the hands of it's most attuned wielders.

And the Shadow is the opposition to the Light, the Holy.
The population in World of Warcraft actually does frown upon Fel Magic and it's Shadow school.

This isn't harry potter where there's only two terms for magicians, Witches and Warlocks.

But Witch is the feminine term for Warlock, alas, foul magician, afflictor, curser. -Bad.


GRAB YOUR TORCHES!

"One of the things you have to realize in Warcraft is, regardless of what they worship, all Priestly power comes from the Light and its dark side the Shadow. It’s just different ways of pulling said power. No worshiped being actually grants any power. Even Elune. The Cult of the Damned has priests in the form of acolytes, remember. They draw upon the Shadow through worship of the Lich King.
The domains are all facets of the Light (and Shadow), chosen and practiced through a particular faiths' rituals and practices.
Whether you worship the Holy Light or Forgotten Shadow (religions, not beings) or not, you still draw upon the Light (source of goodness) or the Shadow (source of evil). This is according to Metzen."
- Adam C. Loyd, WoW RPG developer

"The 'Light' and the 'Shadow' are both philosophies of a sort, but they also tap into universal powers that are at play in the cosmos. Good and Evil are real things – not just ideological distinctions."
- Chris Metzen

Eat that you gits, you suck, we win!

Berathil OOC:

a) She was clad in dark robes with a staff that physically glowed black. ->Holyyyy shit! How's this even possible! I thought glowing was the emanation of Light... which... black, or shadow, is the exact opposite off... BUT IT WAS PHYSICALLY GLOWING BLACK!<- That is more than enough to warrant your attack, even without the mount, simply because the use of Shadow magic is outlawed within the Kingdom of Stormwind ->Awesome! By whom by the way? Seeing as how even goddam Holier than Thou Tirion Fordring understood that both Deathknights and Shadow wielders (For the Death Knights do deal with Shadow and Unholy powers as well) are crucial to turning the tides of the Wars in which we're in.<- No matter how many times you put your hands over your ears and shout "LALALALA" that fact will not change. ->Mainly because it wasn't a fact in the first place, so you got a point there.<-
b) Imanuel was ignored ICly on the grounds that what he was saying went against what the people present were seeing. Wielders of Shadow are known to have spells that afflict the mind and so it was only logical that the parties involved thought that that was what had happened; it makes a lot more sense than a Draenei Shadow Priest being a minister within the Stormwind Council, anyway. ->Now, was the personal attack to someone's else's character development, estabilished over several years of roleplay on this server, needed?<-
c) Warlocks are outlawed just like cultists and Shadow Priests; ->I'll keep that in mind, during WPvP event, when you need a few Chaos Bolts to save your ass. And again, that is a mistake. They are not outlawed, but rather tolerated, even if distrusted. They are seen, much like Death Knights as a necessary evil<- that's why they hide in basements inside of casting their spells in the public eye. ->Not really, again, you're pulling facts out of nowhere, and if you spent less time sitting on your own high horse, you'd see perhaps that there's a logical reasoning behind it. Often, much like a slaughter house, we keep unpleasant things away from the public eye to create a better atmosphere. However, by no means is it outlawed, unless you'd much rather turn vegetarian.<- Using them as an example doesn't hold up. ->It just did!<- Death Knights of the Ebon Blade are permitted their mounts because they're just that - Death Knights of the Ebon Blade. ->And warlocks aren't Warlocks? What?<- The King allowed them to stay in Stormwind as allies, not citizens, and so the same rules don't apply. ->Actually, you're still pulling facts from where the sun doesn't shine. He says that they're to be welcomed as the heroes which they once were. Which implies that they not only are to be welcomed in the Alliance, but actually earn back all their rights of citizenship lost upon death, seeing as how they're back in the faction which they originaly belonged to. Arguing further is useless and ridiculous, as we have no other source of information, other than speculation.<-

***

You say that actions should have consequences even though you RP a character which is incongruous with the lore without any adverse effects. ->Server lore. The world in which we live in, is static by deffinition until each new expansion or major content patch pops over. And even then, it gives us no progress or information on the status of the previous plots<- I honestly can't take you seriously; ->Neither can I, seeing as how you simply popped up one day in this server and decided you'd start to make claims which overstep any reasonable boundaries. Now, I'm not one to keep anyone from roleplaying anything. I'm Roleplaying an Emperor for Christ's sake. But I find it retarded that suddenly someone came up and said "I WANNA BE THE INQUISITION, ACKNOWLEDGE ME!" which is just damn silly all over.<- have you never heard the saying, "don't throw stones if you live in a glass house"? Only once your character has been removed from the Council and executed will I bother with your hypocritical drivel. -> Now, who's again taking IC out of context? <-

Christopher: The Chapter of Holy Anethion are like the church of England in the middle-ages, dont belive in the Light (Christianity)? We dont like you. You use Shadow magic (Witchcraft)? We purge you. In our mind, users are Shadow magic are enemies ->The hell did you just say?<-, and how is he a much bigger threat than you? ->Aye, that's all fine and dandy, but there are much bigger threats out there than Cultists and Shadow Wielders at the moment. Wouldn't you say so, my dear Christopher? *wink wink* <- He is one of the leaders of a major advancement into Duskwood, and you are big enough of a problem to cause this topic. ->Sooo... the problem is the person who's come to help you... and, the topic is a consequence of her use of clothing... fucking fashion taste. Women these days.<-

Mordazan:
Mandui, in spite of being on "your side" (IE against the chapter Wink) I really feel that I have to point out a few things. Please read this in good faith. It is not a personal attack or an attempt to harm you, trashtalk you or in any way undermine you as a person or a roleplayer.

I think you are mixing up OOC and IC. -> Actually lad, that's not exactly the problem at hand. I'll explain in a moment what the issue is. Mandui's not complaining about the attack and stabbing itself<-

Berathil says ICly: I'm a fanatic, I attack people that looks like cultists or wears something that implies shadowmagic (great examples: Black robes, a staff glowing black ->Fucking hell, I really want one of those, seriously<-, an undead horse, etc.)

Yes that is a flawed and illogical way of thinking, but heck, the guy is a fanatic! He does not think rationally or logically.

Berathil says ICly: She has done evil magic to take over Imanuel's mind.

Yes, he makes "baseless and wrong assumptions and act upon them." Exactly. Because that is how his character works.


When you say that you will not change Mandui's personality and clothing style, that is your choice.
But to echo yourself, the choices we make has consequences. When you dress like something that looks evil, expect some characters to think that she is evil.

You don't have to change anything, you just have the accept the consequences of not changing.
->Indeed, my dear Mordazan. But the point is that accepting consequences goes both ways. And that is what's not happening at all. While Mandui accepted to being stabbed and mistreated (even in the past ressurgence of the Chapter) when she presented her case to the Council, she was demonized in an OOC fashion and this whole flame fest first began<-

I hope this is being read in good faith as it is an attempt to solve the OOC part of the matter OOCly. The IC conflict should be alive and RPed out!!

P.S:
I also urge people to remember that this is, in essence, an event between The Dark Sphere and The Chapter of Holy Anethion. True, everyone is really encuraged to come by, but if you don't like what you see, you don't have to . .->Aye, while it is a Chapter-Sphere event, other people were invited to make a part of it. The moment you invite someone, it's only fair that you be a good host and actually accomodate the party to everyone, accordingly to the outcome of certain events, instead of following simply the set script. (Don't count the whole crashing of the cemetery event, as that was a horrible unintentional mistake on my behalf, as we thought your raid, was the DRS raid we suffered earlier)<-

Shriyaro: That isn't how your original OOC response reads though, it reads as an attack against the motivations of the other player characters. ie, you telling them it was wrong of their characters to attack you because it is not what their characters would do (or any characters). It also imposes a requirement for IC consequences that you have no OOC right to demand and no IC power to enforce, excepting a mass invasion of Darkshire from Stormwind to overthrow the Chapter and impose your own rule. ->Actually, that's hardly the point. We're not speaking about an OOC right here, but simply what her character would do. She was a member of the Council (Who has been a working body in the server for a long time now) and who aided and supported the Chapter. All she is doing, ICly mind you, is revoking her support, by showing the testemony as what happened to her, being an inocent in the conflict and actually trying to help.<- Something that you can certainly try, but would rather ruin the RP fun actually going on there. ->So... they're allowed to play their characters and she's not?<-

Christopher: I doubt that, Rivendares Death Charger was added as a rare item incase anyone wonders. Such as Anzu and the Warglaives, simply added for the fun and fact they are a rare item that people will want to get. If the master of the horse dies, it would probably never serve someone again unless they tamed it with some sort of necromancy. ->Wait, no one ever claimed that Mandui took RIVENDARE'S SPECIFIC HORSE.<- And if your using Necromancy, the fact that a shadow draenei priest in the council of a city that belives in the light, will become even more of an epic facedesk, ofcourse nothing personal and I dont mean to insult, its just abit... Stupid. ->You didn't mean to insult but you did it anyway. The point of it is, the horse could've been acquired through a miriad of means, and not all of them being Necromancy made by her. What makes you think that she didn't find an artifact of sorts that summons the horse? Or that she was given one at some point in time, or even collected it as a trophy, out of curiosity AFTER SLAUGHTERING your not-so-dear enemies? Your assumptions, which escalated into an OOC nature in this silly conflict only make the matter worse.<-

Rhebecca: I will say I did whisper Mandui OOC about the same matter I won't deny that. I hate it myself when she has or had to hear accusations like this from anyone else in the first place. I also might be the cause to spark this sudden burst of hatred towards Mandui. And would like to say i have nothing in personal against Mandui or her character i am just seeing this from a point where this ridiculous scene has been ignored to long.

And in tried to ask her kindly top stop using the Shadow Aura or the horse this might have been different from Manduis point of view.
A Simple reason for this all in my eyes would be : Mandui is a member of the council and in some respect has to give an example to other rp'ers on this server and outside of this server if she likes it or not. On top of that as we all know the council members are often accused of elitsm ( If that even is a word ) I won'' argue here that this is wrong or not. But for alot of people running around on a horse like that does show it to them. That they are allowed to do anything they want. Even if it is stupid. ->Or rather, they're willing to undertake in the roleplay which it might bring, be it good, or a conflict. However, consequences of this conflict have to be taken from both sides. And I'll state for something here. You've chosen to roll on this server, with it's own estabilished server lore, which actually works for a fun community... and well, if you've chosen to roll here, why do you keep moaning and protesting about the server's own specific lore? What's the need for it?<-
You have to consider that I, and some others can't take your RP serious when the council has a shadowy charlady riding on top of a skeleton mount. along with a bunch of shadow energy flowing out of her. ->Despite her having proven her loyalty to the Alliance over and over again, in battles which you people are too weak to fight, because you hide behind a veil of "strictly IC" and forget the nature of this server, in which battles and WPvP affects the directions which our Roleplay takes. If anything, she's ICly, shed her blood over years of Roleplay and battles which were fought for Stormwind while most people currently simply state "I fought in the third war" as their background story. While that's fine and dandy, it show very little, if not an outright incoherence with the events which often come to pass.<- I think in the WoW universe the citizen would already have united to burn her on a nice pyre, ->Because we all know that murder's not a crime<- Especially now that king Varian is back and he seems to be rather unkind to anything but human and Mandui is a Draenei if you had not noticed that yet. ->Which reminds me that Varian would have no Kingdom to come back to if the Draenei had not taught them how to effectively fight the Legion in the Outlands<-

This should have been done when Wotlk had launched way back: Either Mandui should resign from her position, be killed for treason and practice of all kind of evil things including owning dead creatures,->And who the hell are you to dictate that? And where did the all kind of evil come from?<-Or be banished form the kingdom for the above reasons since even the humans could see the Draenei are dying and killing one of them like that would result in unwanted tension. -> Again, this is a silly argument, as Stormwind, as a part of the Alliance, needs all the help it can get.<-
Ontop of that Necromany and demonology would be punishable by death again with the human laws again. ->Uhm... care to bring me the Kingdom of Stormwind's Magna Carta? I searched for quite a while for it and never found it. It made me sad. Maybe you can help me? <- But this is just my personal opinion about most matters and some points i have discussed it with others who did agree on some of the points i speak of here. ->And well... wait. If this is your personal oppinion, why do you speak of it as if it were A) Lore-fundamented and B) Everyone else's and C) The oppinion of the NPC population? I'm confused. It'd seem as if you just destroyed your whole point here. o.O <-

Berathil: "One of the things you have to realize in Warcraft is, regardless of what they worship, all Priestly power comes from the Light and its dark side the Shadow. It’s just different ways of pulling said power. No worshiped being actually grants any power. Even Elune. The Cult of the Damned has priests in the form of acolytes, remember. They draw upon the Shadow through worship of the Lich King.
The domains are all facets of the Light (and Shadow), chosen and practiced through a particular faiths' rituals and practices.
Whether you worship the Holy Light or Forgotten Shadow (religions, not beings) or not, you still draw upon the Light (source of goodness) or the Shadow (source of evil). This is according to Metzen."
- Adam C. Loyd, WoW RPG developer

"The 'Light' and the 'Shadow' are both philosophies of a sort, but they also tap into universal powers that are at play in the cosmos. Good and Evil are real things – not just ideaological distinctions." - Chris Metzen

Indeed, but in reply to this I also quote "The Holy Light of Creation grants supernatural healing and, in some cases, destructive powers to anyone who follows the strict discipline prescribed by its religious philosophy. The Forgotten Shadow provides similar powers to those people who follow its nihilistic religious doctrine." And well... wait. Does this speak of the Holy Light's destructive power? Oh my... It does state here that the Shadow grants powers similar to your own, but tapping it from a different philosophy. In the end, it'd seem to me that it's just a tool. The concepts of Light and Shadow are too ambiguous in order to be defined as good or evil. More often than not what one developer says, it's different from what another states. I've seen plenty of explanations for the shadow even from official sources. Hell, even goddam WoWwiki states different things depending on how you search for it. There is the Magic School, Shadow. The Philosophical Doctrine. The Religion. And all of them are one. The point of Shadow is to be the opposite of the Light. But both can be good or bad, depending on the user as they give both the power to save and the power to destroy---DIVINESTORM WOOO!!!

Alrighty, ladies and gentlemen, now that in the first part of my post, I've been satirical, silly, tried to provide some silly entertainment and laughter, while still proving a point, it's time to move to the actual content of my post.

Mandui is not complaining over being attacked ICly. The problem which is here at hand is the fact that when she tried to reply ICly, as it should've been, people decided to attack her, rather than roleplaying along. She's not complaining over the fact that you attacked her character, she's complaining over the fact that upon reacting, you attacked her OOCly. And kept doing so, going from simple lies regarding the use of Shadowform in which there was none, to the questioning of her position in the Council which is a part of the character development which has been ocurring ever since the release of TBC and the character creation. Who are you to suddenly pop over and deny it in an OOC fashion? Who are any of you to come around and say that something can't be done while it has worked perfectly for several years now? Moreso, who are you to come and dictate that the Lore which we've estabilished in this server, as a community is wrong? This is the setting in which you've WILLINGLY CHOSEN to settle yourself in and develop your character. You want to make a change? Do it in character. Whining and the likes will get us nowhere, ruins everyone's fun, and might bring even other less desirable consequences.

There are also several other incongruencies in your speech, such as the fact that you state that you make no claim of authority, IC or OOC, and yet you simply estabilished an inquisition without trying to sort it out with the rest of the community, so there would be a space made accordingly to make sure all worked well. But instead, you said "THE KING APPROVES!" and "NO ONE EXPECTS THE AZEROTHIAN INQUISITION" and forced your way in. Now, the Chapter is a great initiative, but in all honesty, you're doing it wrong. You invite people to your events, but follow strict script in which others have no place in. And the moment in which IC outcomes affect that script of yours, shit hits the fan.

NO ONE has tried yet to pull Mandui to a corner and say "Look, mind not being dressed like the enemy in the middle of a warzone?" Perhaps her character, while full of good intentions despite her clothing and powers, thinks that she's well known enough not to be attacked on sight? Haven't you yet seen that she doesn't know everything and isn't all knowledgeable? Perhaps, after so many wars and awkward situations such as this one, common sense's not that strong a point?

So why all the OOC attacks on her IC reaction and sometimes even person? Whispers saying "You shouldn't do this" are no less than idiotic because nothing will change. Why would anyone change their characters because of silly OOC harassment? I'm sorry, but I for one do not see that as the sort of population I want in my server.

Recapping, it's not a matter of what Shadow or Evil actually is. She could be sacrificing lil' children in a basement for all you knew, but... you don't know that! And therefore ICly, and as a trusted member of the Alliance, which has proven herself over and over IC and OOC, through both participation and organising of events, she has the upper hand here. You were walking around on your parole and you blew it the moment you decided to attack innocents and even allies, regardless of the color of their robes. There's no reason to start a flame war or flame festival, because she's behaving ICly JUST like you guys did. It's not her background that's important here, but rather the present. And that's where people are failing to see it. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but is this not the true issue at hand?

Is there anyone else who thinks the same?

Shrogan, that post, was one of the most, retarded, stupid, lie-filled, piece of bullshit I have ever read, right up there next to the bible, you just made an epicly long post with the same thing being facerolled over and over, simply because you and Mandui have got somthing going on over there in the shadows... As Mandui said about her posts shes been saying the same thing, but thats practicly what you did in your post.

Chrístophér/Elízabeth wrote:Shrogan, that post, was one of the most, retarded, stupid, lie-filled, piece of bullshit I have ever read, right up there next to the bible, you just made an epicly long post with the same thing being facerolled over and over, simply because you and Mandui have got somthing going on over there in the shadows... As Mandui said about her posts shes been saying the same thing, but thats practicly what you did in your post.

15:15:48 [Gerogx] whispers: Listen dude.
15:16:06 [Gerogx] whispers: Your guild is just another Blacklisted. Fucking up RP events and camping RPers, and im sick of it.
15:16:32 [Gerogx] whispers: I am amazingly tempted to simply get loads of alliance to fuck up your events and camp the shit out of every one of you.
15:16:36 To [Gerogx]: Are you done?
15:16:43 [Gerogx] whispers: Yep.
15:16:51 To [Gerogx]: Have a nice day
15:17:01 [Gerogx] whispers: >_>

This is the sort of abuse I get in whispers from you, lad, after being ICly invited to partake in the events going on at Duskwood. Now, have you anything to add to that?

I do have somthing to add to that, because I -have- been camped by you and your bullshit of a guild over and over again in the past and frankly if you keep it up I will gank the shit out of you for not heeding warnings.

I rest my case.

I know I didn't.

And I amazingly through ingame whispers I havent been negative to Mandui at all, infact with you I was complaining about you and your guild that I dislike for camping me 1000 times and attacking multiple events along with camping Darkshire a number of times.

Chrístophér/Elízabeth wrote: I will gank the shit out of you for not heeding warnings.

I will like to see you try.

There are OOC people who are like Blacklisted on the Alliance side too...

And you guys like hanging on a cliff. /Knockback
Not that I approove of such people but I also dont approve of being ganked... And yes I am willing to sink to your level \o/

Chrístophér/Elízabeth wrote: but I also dont approve of being ganked... /

Sorry, I believe this is a PVP realm, is it not?