The discussion about the Shields gathers here.

Again you just ignore the point, if an event is fun that is all well and good, but might it not have been more fun if more people had been able to attend and "enjoy" the event?

Except your side was an organized event, and our side was a rabble of whoever happened to be online and noticing it.

Hence the selfishness.

Not informing others of a planned RP event is, at worst, a minor inconvenience owing to the fact that if you don't know about it, you might miss it. I wouldn't say that it violates the unwritten rule about consentual RP though.

This seems to me, an impartial outside observer, like an issue blown out of proportion by exisiting friction

Mansfield \ Ath wrote:

Nygarth wrote:

It is annoying though, logically IC, we would've all been there, most likely predicting and preparing for an influx in crime since the Shields left...It's just so annoying when realism ingame, is defeated by realism inlife.

-Me

ICly all 100 Shields would be online always. ICly all 80 members of all crime-guilds would have been online and the whole thing would have been EVEN bigger. So the same thing stands, you cannot have everyone online at all times, this counts for both sides. Guards -and- criminals.

Yet the odds would under normal circumstances be balanced, more or less the same percentage online on both sides. Something that is not the case when one side is informed and the other is not.

Head, meet brick wall.

Damn this is getting stupid now.

Netherian Helmsley wrote:Again you just ignore the point, if an event is fun that is all well and good, but might it not have been more fun if more people had been able to attend and "enjoy" the event?

Might've worked the other way, though, with all the criminals being immediately arrested, and the event coming to nothing whatsoever.

You're dealing in what-ifs here, and that's not really stable enough ground to have meaningful discussion on. I think what's going to be said's already been dumped in this thread, and that we ought to drop the issue for now.

I don't care what you did, who you hurt, what you burnt and who you ridiculed with your event last night.

I just want to be involved in things, that are obviously big, preplanned and to a degree involve me. Especially when everyone involved is saying it was so much fun, hence the selfishness and the to a degree, OOC organizing for biased groups that Tirius -admits- to.

You're preaching that the event was a ton of fun for all that was involved? Why the heck couldn't you spread the fun?

Oh wait, then the burning orphanage might've got put out, or the screaming citizen might've got aid or the Blazing Shields might've been put the shame. That's not right, is it.

Except the whole point of us not informing you was to blow yer minds and suprise you lot. You not being prepared was part of our event, a suddenly suprise crime-spree, how will the guards deal with that? Rather than them being super prepared and ready and waiting. (Wich would be metagaming.)

Plus, you weren't involved. Nygarth wasn't involved. Perhaps if you had made the effort to roleplay w/ the lot of us you would have had as much fun during the event as the rest of the people had.

Next time I hope to see you there, during such events, and have fun like the rest of us actually roleplaying instead of being on the forum stating how much you disagree -not- being informed. Sorry, but you cannot be part of everything that goes on.

Nygarth wrote:You're preaching that the event was a ton of fun for all that was involved? Why the heck couldn't you spread the fun?

Oh wait, then the burning orphanage might've got put out, or the screaming citizen might've got aid or the Blazing Shields might've been put the shame. That's not right, is it.

Because then it would have only been fun for one side; The guards. And the orphanage wasn't even part of the main event, it was done by a solo after the event. And also.. I don't see how the current guards defending Stormwind puts the Blazing Shields to shame in any way. I'm sure they are very capable in doing so.

Anyway, in my eyes the issue has been thoroughly discussed - and every aspect of it - and that calls this discussion to an end with the opinions being;

Current temporary guards:
"You should have informed us, so we could stop all of you by preparing alot more and have fun ourselves. It would have been more realistic if we were all on and prepared for a huge crime-wave."

Criminals:
"Nah, we didn't want you to stop all off us, that would have not been fun and realistic as you could not have seen it coming.. We wanted to suprise you and cause chaos all over the city. It was our event."

Both sides are clear now. The argumentation and discussion is now to an end and people can stick to their opinions. Alot of people had fun and that's what matters. That you didn't have fun and weren't involved might have been a little selfish, but you cannot invite the whole community to all of your RP.

Nygarth wrote:I don't care what you did, who you hurt, what you burnt and who you ridiculed with your event last night.

I just want to be involved in things, that are obviously big, preplanned and to a degree involve me. Especially when everyone involved is saying it was so much fun, hence the selfishness and the to a degree, OOC organizing for biased groups that Tirius -admits- to.

You're preaching that the event was a ton of fun for all that was involved? Why the heck couldn't you spread the fun?

Oh wait, then the burning orphanage might've got put out, or the screaming citizen might've got aid or the Blazing Shields might've been put the shame. That's not right, is it.

What on earth are you talking about? I've implied none of those things, and you're coming off as somewhat hysterical.

If you'd take care to re-read my post, I was saying that at this stage (namely everyone shouting about fantastical scenarios that could have been) no benefit can come from further discussion.

As for your anger at not being contacted and informed, please take a deep breath and remember that it was one event. Now try to behave a little reasonably, and let the matter go. You've all made your points, and now there's literally nothing but mud-slinging to be had here.

Assuming again, it wouldn't just have been fun for the guards...You still had the numbers, and the IC preparation. All we would've had was the ability to know to be online, and RP randomly. You didn't even have to tell us the event, it could've been anything and you would've had just as much fun, but so would we.

And please read things twice before commenting on it, I'm implying that if we had of been involved on an OOC basis with the event, then perhaps you would've been put to shame, hence why we wasn't. To keep the Shields glorifyed, which has been a major concept throughout this thread.

---

And who the heck is Trollmeat, and when have I mentioned anything he's said? ;s Excuse my ignorance.

Apologies, but you posted directly after me without quotes, and I assumed your harangue was directed at me.

Carry on.

Meh, no reason to carry on. I think all the points have been made and god knows -no- proper conclusion is going to come from further discussion.

I agree with you, only further mud-slinging is commencing, so I'll put down my mud and leave...I need lunch.

You guys could actually discuss something more important, for example what will the current guards and the council do -after- the crime spree. Useless flaming and preaching about useless things leads nowhere. I still stand on my point, if the guards would've gotten informed about it OOC it would've been all meta game and three thousand guards armed and ready to arrest every single one of the criminals and ruining the event just 'cause they are very bad losers.

And now that they didn't got informed they are preaching how it should've have been made. I mean, get real, even if you dont get to RP the all mighty guards, it doesn't mean you can flame the event to ashes. It rarely happens that us criminals get to do any kind of impact on the majority of people. Finally we got something new here and you're just trying to ruin it by accusing people who organized the event selfish or the like. Now it's the guards time to make a counter. Cut with the OOC arguments and get down to IC business, newspapers making big articles about this thing, council emergency meeting(s), runner to the shields, strict new protocols and temporary arresting policy. Fight back! Not OOC but IC, do what you're supposed to do as a part of the SW RP community.

Raviran wrote:You guys could actually discuss something more important, for example what will the current guards and the council do -after- the crime spree. Useless flaming and preaching about useless things leads nowhere. I still stand on my point, if the guards would've gotten informed about it OOC it would've been all meta game and three thousand guards armed and ready to arrest every single one of the criminals and ruining the event just 'cause they are very bad losers.

And here is a perfect example that people care too much about "winning". I don't really have anything more to say on the whole matter.

May I suggest people stop tossing insults, assumptions, theories, what-ifs and whatnot around and instead just say if they enjoyed the event (or the general idea) or not and give suggestions on how it could have been improved for the future?

Personally I missed it so I can't comment on wether or not it was enjoyable, but I see no fault in it. In hindsight, sending a "on the evening of the 20th something will happen in Stormwind" to the impromptu guards would perhaps have been polite.

Us criminals can rarely ever -win- against the guards, now this was perfect chance to show the people IC that we're still up and about. That the streets aren't as safe as they seem to be.

Raviran wrote:Us criminals can rarely ever -win- against the guards, now this was perfect chance to show the people IC that we're still up and about. That the streets aren't as safe as they seem to be.

The way I feel about criminal RP is that there is far too much street mugging and blind violence rather than sneakiness. It seems pretty damn repetitive.

*take out Blazing Shield = Insert Gangs of Stormwind?*

Netherian Helmsley wrote:

Raviran wrote:Us criminals can rarely ever -win- against the guards, now this was perfect chance to show the people IC that we're still up and about. That the streets aren't as safe as they seem to be.

The way I feel about criminal RP is that there is far too much street mugging and blind violence rather than sneakiness. It seems pretty damn repetitive.

-.-.... there is too much of that sneakiness, but you can't see it cause they're "Subtle / Sneaky".... too subtle guilds tend to be forgotten as they rarely do anything on the streets. Mugging / killing / assaulting / racketeering the innocent is what crime really is. If you're too "Subtle" You and the guards will both get less RP. Being subtle is good sometimes but being active on the streets is what really makes us criminals.

Netherian Helmsley wrote:

Raviran wrote:Us criminals can rarely ever -win- against the guards, now this was perfect chance to show the people IC that we're still up and about. That the streets aren't as safe as they seem to be.

The way I feel about criminal RP is that there is far too much street mugging and blind violence rather than sneakiness. It seems pretty damn repetitive.

I'd just like to state that there's something wrong with your way of thinking if you think street mugging and blind violence isn't the norm in a city. If thinking these things don't occur a lot in cities in real life, then you really need to get out more and look at the world around you because there is ALWAYS violence going on somewhere, whether it's a drunken fight or a simple mugging, there's always violence occurring, especially in cities.

This is what I don't like about Alliance; anything different from being a goody-goody-gumdrop citizen and players get cast out, ignored and mocked.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with criminal gangs and guilds in any RP setting. Just because Stormwind has pretty music in the background doesn't mean the entire human race are a bunch of noble heroes hell-bent on goodness and justice. The insane 'sugar, spice and everything nice' attitude people seem to have is something people need to get rid of. Why the HELL do criminal activities HAVE to be said to the council OOC before it happens anyways? Who made up that pish rule?

The Alliance and even some members of the Horde have to get real and out of this goody-gumdrop attitude. It makes RP for us criminals a hell of a lot harder when you're stuck in your sunshine and flowers world where farts are magical rainbows and snot is ambrosia.

There, I said what I wanted to say. The criminals of the Alliance should be free from the shackles of OOC oppression.

I see what ya did thar', so there is some goodfellas in the Horde side too afterall

Indeed they're is. We at the 60T get them all the time, they even bully our members OOCly for it to try and chase them out of the guild and game (there have been a few of our members who have suffered from this behaviour). To be quite frank, it's stupid, disgusting and should be banned completely. I could name a few of my members (even non-members) who have been bullied OOC for being a criminal, but I won't for privacy reasons.

We Shields have personally always been the hardcore morally questionable cops, who use morally questionable means against the hard-core gangs of Stormwind, who do serious crimes, murder, mugging and drug-trade!

It's pretty mature-themed and something different for sure! So if you want to get involved with hardcore cops vs. hardcore criminals, in a mature setting where the crime they do is harsh, but they get beaten up and shot in a harsh way too, join either the Shields or the various array of crime-guilds and get away from the do-goodie noble hero-paladins!

Also, we have excellent OOC communication and friendship! In both guild-chat and interguild talking!

Join the Blazing Shields -today-! Or their enemies!