Soul weave (ooc discusion and workplace)

Zryse wrote:

Thelos wrote:I can't imagine that Drustai would ever say that Fel made Necromancy, either OOC or IC.

I think she did say something along the lines of it OOCly. I'm not 100% sure though. . . I was behind Shadow at the time IRL when they were speaking of it, and I was invited to look at the chat from over his shoulder.

My memory is not overly-accurate however, due to it being a while back.

It would be more accurate to say demons created necromancy, I can't find anything that states fel magic was involved.

They didn't, though. As far as we know.

And demons are demonic.. or fel?

Fel is warcrafts own special way of saying "Demonic", basically.

So its right then? we sorted here XD? Fel=demonic that can be used necroticly?

Yes.

Though there are no examples of that happening directly in world of warcraft as far as I know, it is entirely feasible that it could exist.

It is however a bit of an overkill for most. You're best off keeping fel and necromancy as separate entities. I don't really see why you would need to involve fel magic in a story so heavy on necromancy, anyway.

So ok Should we cut fel from the mix and keep it Necrotic?

I think that would be for the best. Keep the core of your concept as simple as possible, I'd say.

Stratholme's undead are caused by the plague Kel'thuzad was spreading then, and the plague was made by Ner'zhul, as commanded by the Legion, the dreadlords were just there to oversee and generally were useless, it's not them who made the plague or the undead in stratholme.

There's not really any direct legion hands dabled in these accounts of necromancy, and necromancy is part of the arcane spectrum of things.

I know me and Drustai have discussed the whole relation between fel and arcane before in debt but uh.. I forget stuff and uh.. what she said about this and what ever conclusion was made, I'll leave her to clarify.

The thing that comes closest to fel and necromancy being mixed (that I can think off in my 4 second attention span) are the Orcish necromancing warlocks that made the first Death Knights, perhaps they used a fel-necromancy, but I'm with Deli, keep your concept simple, and just go with the arcane necromantics.

Arcane *shudders* very well. But now.. the source of it is done.. i want to debate something..

Mana.. im in a bit of a pickle.. Mana.. is magic.. yes soul weave is magic. but uses life force. How do we work it around?

Drefurion wrote:The thing that comes closest to fel and necromancy being mixed (that I can think off in my 4 second attention span) are the Orcish necromancing warlocks that made the first Death Knights, perhaps they used a fel-necromancy, but I'm with Deli, keep your concept simple, and just go with the arcane necromantics.

And possubly soulstones? Kind of necro-ish-like... But whatever.

Keep it simple and it'll be simpler to explain in character and it will all end up being a lot less confusing, and you'll get a lot more people on board willing to play out your stories with you. And really, isn't that what it's all about? Generating fun stories?

I'm going to go now, I'll see to reading the entire thing when I get home in a couple of hours.

Shadowrénd wrote:Mana.. im in a bit of a pickle.. Mana.. is magic.. yes soul weave is magic. but uses life force. How do we work it around?

To cite the Work-in-progress, and gigantic, magic guide Drustai has been working on for... Forever:

Drustai's Tome wrote:-Mana, the Building Block of Magic and the Soul-

Mana is commonly presented in WoW as raw spiritual energy. It is within everything, from the smallest pebble to the mightiest dragon. It is the soul. And it is mana that all casters—arcane and divine—use in the powering of their magic. It is to the soul what blood is to the body, and nowhere is this more obvious than the ley-lines, veritable arteries and veins of mana running through a planet’s ‘body’.

You would still be using mana in some way. Everything does.

In Death Knight rune magic though, it is the sword and the runes engraved on it that channel the mana, not the death knight itself. Soo.. I have no idea how that helps but I really have to go now.

Delidah wrote:

Drefurion wrote:The thing that comes closest to fel and necromancy being mixed (that I can think off in my 4 second attention span) are the Orcish necromancing warlocks that made the first Death Knights, perhaps they used a fel-necromancy, but I'm with Deli, keep your concept simple, and just go with the arcane necromantics.

And possubly soulstones? Kind of necro-ish-like... But whatever.

Keep it simple and it'll be simpler to explain in character and it will all end up being a lot less confusing, and you'll get a lot more people on board willing to play out your stories with you. And really, isn't that what it's all about? Generating fun stories?

I'm going to go now, I'll see to reading the entire thing when I get home in a couple of hours.

Death Coil, Health Funnel are closer to necromancing than any sort of Fel spell.

It's also for this reason I perceive the term "warlock" as a, to some degree, trashcan term for anyone that dabbles in any form of dark arts, being fel and necromancy, rather than just being a fel-caster.

As for the life force, isn't that just the same as mana? Get Drustai in this thread plix.

Edit: scrap what I said about life force, I am ignorant.

second i see her log ill get drustai in here right now trying to solo nax

Mana is the magical stuff that souls are made of. Life/nature force/magic is the life magic that keeps people alive. Think of one as mana and the other as HP.

As for "soul weave" im not going to comment but if you are once more going down the gift of life root please do not bring it to my guild again.

Shadowrénd wrote:1. Ok first of all.. I call apon what Drustia has told me That Fel made necromancey so it dose work.

Drustai, while having quite alot of intresting ideas and interpertations on the subject is not an authority, provided she said just that

Shadowrénd wrote:5. Yes yes.. rather Clesay for the sword but the fasion the main blades of the weave crators used to forges there to make the swords so its only fit i make it so its a Long jorney to destroy the blades.

Perhaps there are alternate ways that your characters have not experienced? Exposure to concentrated holy light or arcane energies for example. The whole fires of mount doom concept isnt optimal imo.

Shadowrénd wrote:2. the blade has weakness but i dont put it in the book because its shadowrend Personal Grimore if some one got there hand on the book well they can kill him ooc i will inform of weaknesses on here

The tome is all the information we have on your ideas right now, perhaps writing OOC information concerning the topic would be apropriate? I mean I'm all for keeping it secret especially to people that may be trying to destroy it because of metagaming but if you are asking for feedback it might be wise to put a little bit more out there.

Shadowrénd wrote:3. The essance of living is becuase of harvesting souls stealing in a way there life force.

All runeblades used by death knights harvests souls, isnt that true? Correct me if I'm wrong. I just dont like the idea that it would bring life back to the wielder or at least partly.

Shadowrénd wrote:7. The weakness of soul weave is the weilders need to use it and the fact there is a number count on how meny he can use without problems accureing. it will be explained more in due time once me and The main helpers sort out the ideas.

Every spell focus operates like that but the blade is no mere spell focus, it is an artifact of immense power that hungers for souls... would it not be more exiting if it provoked anger, bloodlust and hate for instance the more you used it or having to make some kind of devils contract with it in general to make full use of it? Also... casting too many spells of any school has drawbacks in general... perhaps there would be more ritual involved when it comes to channeling the powers rather then them being fairly easy to pull out your sleeve. I mean some of this just seems Frostmourne-epic to me or even beyond Frostmourne-epic.

Braiden wrote:Drustai, while having quite alot of intresting ideas and interpertations on the subject is not an authority, provided she said just that

I didn't realise there was an "authority" in RP anyway? Granted, while there are certain measures us fellow RP'ers have to think of, and act upon, there is no true Authority.

EDIT: Your ideas are good, however. I do not mean to be 'nitpicking' as it's called.

Shadowrénd wrote:Arcane *shudders* very well. But now.. the source of it is done.. i want to debate something..

Mana.. im in a bit of a pickle.. Mana.. is magic.. yes soul weave is magic. but uses life force. How do we work it around?

In lore terms, the textbook definition of magic in Warcraft is an ever-present field of energy — the result of the Well of Eternity's waters being spread to the entirety of the world. While this is common knowledge, there was a great debate within the magical community regarding exactly how magic allows a user to manipulate elements of a plane of existence. The Kirin Tor were arguing if, say, fire was created because of physical forces dictated and powered with the help of magic or whether the fire was summoned from another parallel existence. Medivh believed magical fire comes into existence because the caster concentrates the inherent nature of fire in a certain area to summon it into being.[1] Medivh also maintained that the practice of magic is "the art of circumventing the normal."[2]

http://www.wowpedia.org/Magic

I also don't remember with who it was, but I had a whole discussion that "Mana" exists, as a concept, ingame.

Zryse wrote:

Braiden wrote:Drustai, while having quite alot of intresting ideas and interpertations on the subject is not an authority, provided she said just that

I didn't realise there was an "authority" in RP anyway? Granted, while there are certain measures us fellow RP'ers have to think of, and act upon, there is no true Authority.

EDIT: Your ideas are good, however. I do not mean to be 'nitpicking' as it's called.

Perhaps a poor choise of words, I merely meant that saying "Drustai told me..." isnt a way to motivate or argue for your opinion or ideas by yourself.

All runeblades used by death knights harvests souls, isnt that true? Correct me if I'm wrong. I just dont like the idea that it would bring life back to the wielder or at least partly.

Runeblades take souls. The DKs body already takes life force when they fight. It is used to keep them in Undeath.

ETA Fel//Shadow. The scourge was created by demons but they rejected them. DKs are nothing to do with Fel magic.

Don't the runeblades take life force? Isn't that the Runic Power that charges them..?

Braiden wrote:

Zryse wrote:

Braiden wrote:Drustai, while having quite alot of intresting ideas and interpertations on the subject is not an authority, provided she said just that

I didn't realise there was an "authority" in RP anyway? Granted, while there are certain measures us fellow RP'ers have to think of, and act upon, there is no true Authority.

EDIT: Your ideas are good, however. I do not mean to be 'nitpicking' as it's called.

Perhaps a poor choise of words, I merely meant that saying "Drustai told me..." isnt a way to motivate or argue for your opinion or ideas by yourself.

Nah, I understood what you meant. Sorry again if it seemed as if I was nitpicking :3 Your point is valid, as I'm sure others will agree.

Lexgrad wrote:

All runeblades used by death knights harvests souls, isnt that true? Correct me if I'm wrong. I just dont like the idea that it would bring life back to the wielder or at least partly.

Runeblades take souls. The DKs body already takes life force when they fight. It is used to keep them in Undeath.

Thank you Lex, you helped me make my point. The energies of souls or life in general is already a key part of a death knights whole cycle of undeath... argueing that a blade would make one look and feel even more alive because it contained the very same energies as every other rune blade wielded by death knights seems like an inadiquate explanation imo, it requires further tought to work.

Drefurion wrote:Don't the runeblades take life force? Isn't that the Runic Power that charges them..?

Runeblades take souls! They use souls as fuel for their runic powers, a process that uses the soul completely. There is no afterlife for those in a rune blade, it is why they are completely evil. (and why lex broke his as he could not go on doing this.)

Souls are mana and not "Life force". The DKs body is powered by an unholy "Necro-biology". All their functions in life are dead, it is not nerves and muscles and blood that makes the DK move for example, it is Magic. But this force degrades leading to pain for the DK. The only way to top this up and sop the pain is to hurt others. As you wound them the DKs body soaks up the wounded/dead victims life force and the Shadow that is generated by their death.

That only goes for vampiric runeblades. "Normal" runeblades don't have that issue.