Re: Sheriff of Westfall

by Guest Sun Mar 13, 2011 1:58 pm

Title fight!

by **Gunnell** Sun Mar 13, 2011 1:58 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Geldar wrote:Don't forget to add "Lord of Gilneas" to your list there.

Also, to the OP. Make events, create RP and earn your rank. No one will say anything if you do that.

Oh, I didn't see that one coming. At all.

Lord of Keel, a town in Gilneas (not 'Gilneas') that we actually worked to actively turn into a roleplaying hub which ironically enough isn't in Yellow so lets-pretend-it-doesn't-exist-here. I picked the title because frankly there needs to be some form of authority figure IC over the masses and every Tom Dick & Harry is liable to proclaim themselves a noble of some degree and pretty much everybody was calling Gunnell "Mi'lord" from the start anyway.

So if you're going to throw in the excuse of "I led a couple of WPvP events" then by this point I should be King-Regent of Gilneas.

It would be Lord-Regent dear, and being Emperor of the Gurubashi is claiming nothing but a title in a guild, the gurubashi are technically extinct (by real lore) so Shrogan is treading on nothing. He earned his title as did all Emperors before him. Just because Keel is a town doesn't change anything. Don't begin to call the kettle black when you are in fact a pot..

Check my updated original post. Naturally, the Stormwind Council circle-jerk leap on me because I've mentioned one of its flock. Also the 'King-Regent' was sarcasm of an exaggerated title, Princess of Arat- Stromgarde.

Oh get off your high horse.. I believe I defended Shrogan, not Geldar. So take your conspiracy theories and shove them where the sun doesn't shine.

Oh, it didn't come down to who you were defending, its just funny how the moment I or another member says somebody negative against a Yellow (Err, Grey) tag they all leap on me to rip my post apart.

by **Valerias** Sun Mar 13, 2011 1:59 pm

Really, anyone who's managed to RP out a title of some kind, and keep it up for awhile, have done it because they have been accepted by the wider community. Whether it's being lord of Keel or a Trollbane (and as crazy an idea as the latter may've seemed at the beginning, Seiken did work hard to become accepted in that role), people will either accept you - in which case you've done a good job and deserve it - or ignore you. Time is a decent judge and will be the judge of the OP in this case - so there's no point mudslinging.

by **Magaskawee/Anaei** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:01 pm

Gunnell wrote:

Oh, it didn't come down to who you were defending, its just funny how the moment I or another member says somebody negative against a Yellow (Err, Grey) tag they all leap on me to rip my post apart.

Oh you are right, I of course only entered this thread because my dear heart was in trouble. Oh wait, you directly insulted my own character and one of my friends while conveniently leaving yourself out. It's called setting the records straight, I couldn't care less what your weird little head thinks it is. You really are paranoid..

by **Geldar** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:04 pm

Oh, I didn't see that one coming. At all.

Lord of Keel, a town in Gilneas (not 'Gilneas') that we actually worked to actively turn into a roleplaying hub which ironically enough isn't in Yellow so lets-pretend-it-doesn't-exist-here. I picked the title because frankly there needs to be some form of authority figure IC over the masses and every Tom Dick & Harry is liable to proclaim themselves a noble of some degree and pretty much everybody was calling Gunnell "Mi'lord" from the start anyway.

So if you're going to throw in the excuse of "I led a couple of WPvP events" then by this point I should be King-Regent of Gilneas.

B'aw, ain't this cute. Have you ever considered that you aren't the only unique snowflake that has seemingly worked for what he has earned?

I picked the title because frankly there needs to be some form of authority figure IC over the masses

Yeah, very different to most cases. Just for reference since it seems we are going to be throwing in this kind of things here, people started referring to my character as "Commander" the moment we were finished the string of war events during the TBC and it was never something "I" unlike you, picked for myself. I simply earned it.

Just like the OP can do, thing here is, its not the problem of Tom, Dick & Harry proclaiming themselves for anything liable. Its the problem of others who think they have the right to simply do so because they have the illusion they've done something worthwhile, and as for the Gilneas hub which you claim its not Yellow enough, its not that the reason people don't visit. It's because you've been an ass to every single guild that has come up there to share the RP, not because it lacks something, thats why people do not come up there. Until then, its not a hub, its simply a guild meeting place.

My 2c.

PS: And what Ana' said, put on those tinfoil hats and let the good times roll!

by **Jehorius** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:04 pm

Stoutmantle can remain the Marshal, Soderbergh could assume the mantle as a Sheriff after proving himself in different kind of ways ICly (Be it events or generally good RP from his side in Westfall). As for the titles, stop being silly.

No matter how much you argue and sling poop at each other subtle, or bluntly - It won't change a damn thing, most people prefer a fancy title. Be it selfproclaimed, or not.

by **Gunnell** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:04 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:

Oh, it didn't come down to who you were defending, its just funny how the moment I or another member says somebody negative against a Yellow (Err, Grey) tag they all leap on me to rip my post apart.

Oh you are right, I of course only entered this thread because my dear heart was in trouble. Oh wait, you directly insulted my own character and one of my friends while conveniently leaving yourself out. It's called setting the records straight, I couldn't care less what your weird little head thinks it is. You really are paranoid..

It wasn't an insult, dear - Check where I specifically insulted you. I noted down a list of titles in extremely high positions (again; I have nothing against Gurubashi Empire but I felt it only fair I stuck Emperor in there or else people are going to say I'm trying to leap on the KoA/Council bandwagon). There seems to be this assumption that if I post something that isn't showered in praise and delight I MUST be trying to insult people.

by **Gunnell** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:06 pm

Geldar wrote:
Oh, I didn't see that one coming. At all.

Lord of Keel, a town in Gilneas (not 'Gilneas') that we actually worked to actively turn into a roleplaying hub which ironically enough isn't in Yellow so lets-pretend-it-doesn't-exist-here. I picked the title because frankly there needs to be some form of authority figure IC over the masses and every Tom Dick & Harry is liable to proclaim themselves a noble of some degree and pretty much everybody was calling Gunnell "Mi'lord" from the start anyway.

So if you're going to throw in the excuse of "I led a couple of WPvP events" then by this point I should be King-Regent of Gilneas.

B'aw, ain't this cute. Have you ever considered that you aren't the only unique snowflake that has seemingly worked for what he has earned?

I picked the title because frankly there needs to be some form of authority figure IC over the masses

Yeah, very different to most cases. Just for reference since it seems we are going to be throwing in this kind of things here, people started referring to my character as "Commander" the moment we were finished the string of war events during the TBC and it was never something "I" unlike you, picked for myself. I simply earned it.

Just like the OP can do, thing here is, its not the problem of Tom, Dick & Harry proclaiming themselves for anything liable. Its the problem of others who think they have the right to simply do so because they have the illusion they've done something worthwhile, and as for the Gilneas hub which you claim its not Yellow enough, its not that the reason people don't visit. It's because you've been an ass to every single guild that has come up there to share the RP, not because it lacks something, thats why people do not come up there. Until then, its not a hub, its simply a guild meeting place.

My 2c.

Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us.

No dear, despite various visitors on most evenings its not a roleplaying hub. Not unless a MODERATOR OF THE ROLEPLAYING COMMUNITY HERPA-DERPA with a Yellow title in their name says it is! How silly of me to think we contributed to the community. How foolish to think our members were trying when some egomaniac who thinks he's king of the RP community because he got given moderation powers on a free-web forum hasn't said we're a hub yet (even if he visted and took advantage of the roleplay there).

How gosh darn silly.

by **Jayse** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:09 pm

A bit harsh? *sadface*

by **Magaskawee/Anaei** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:10 pm

Gunnell wrote:
Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us, or-

Gunnell, when the Era started you used the motto, "All other guilds will die off, don't talk to them and don't rp with them."

You are an elitist Gunnell and an asshole and i've told people you aren't for way too long..

by **Jehorius** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:12 pm

Sometimes people just have enough, I would have reacted the same way, but probably silently. It somewhat feels if people assume Gunnell take each opportunity he can to whine and complain about certain people on this server. Lay down your axes already, please. Smile

by **Gunnell** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:15 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us, or-

Gunnell, when the Era started you used the motto, "All other guilds will die off, don't talk to them and don't rp with them."

You are an elitist Gunnell and an asshole and i've told people you aren't for way too long..

Which goes directly against the point of turning Gilneas into a hub. I'll admit there was a fairly smug attitude that came about because of the hundreds of Worgen guilds that died off in about a week, but naturally people don't like me and thus spread bollocks that we were trying to ban people from Gilneas and not roleplay with them. Of course people looking for any excuse to rip the Worgen community apart of admit that there exists RP not created by the 'celebraties' leaped on the flaw and blew it out of proportions.

Gilneas is a roleplaying hub whether you like it or not. Is it massive? No, obviously its not the cathedral square but when people claim it isn't.. well, I could list plenty of apparant 'hubs' that are glorified guild meeting spots too.

by **Antistia** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:16 pm

Victor Soderbergh wrote:Anyone that has any objections if I may recieve the title as Sheriff or Marshal of Westfall?
More information etc you will find on Looking for Roleplay.

Note, I don't know the situation in Westfall with NPC's apart from what I've read in this topic.

Personally I feel that you could take one of these positions. There is however a marshal already in Westfall so I think you should pick a rank which is below that of marshal. The reason is simple, then the hierarchy Blizzard implemented in the zone remains which is kind of how it should be with governmental institutions. It's not per se limiting of your RP either, it allows for you to report to the marshal, allows for your char to have pet peeves about him, etc etc. It also ensures your character has a goal: Eventually being promoted and replacing the marshal. Of course it's just an example.

Then you just RP like your position requires and organize events, if it goes well, people accept you. If it goes wrong and people don't recognize your position then that's too bad. But it's not the end, it's just another opportunity for your character to develop.

by **Gunnell** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:17 pm

Jayse wrote:A bit harsh? *sadface*

Sorry babe, I enjoyed SI:7 being there. Frankly though, I just lost it a little bit when people take advantage of the roleplaying (in this case afore mentioned Nelf) and claim that its not part of the community.

Also Sheriff is in a seperate chain of command to Marshal; Marshal being a military rank over a province/area whilst Sheriff is a more.. civilian, law enforcement title. They could perhaps both be on the same level-ish (although naturally Stoutmantle being who he is would take precedent) but Sheriff taking a more active approach to finding lost cattle and the odd thief than going on a war march against the Defias or Gnolls as the Westfall Brigade are.

by **Rmuffn** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:20 pm

Etular wrote:Despite agreeing with both the above, I must bring up an important point (that has, most likely, been argued to no end):

Faralan Thorgint wrote:
Who claim big titles for your own ego's sake, I might ask?

Personally I'm the Kardonir of Arathor, not because I claimed to be high and mighty or an ego.
But because I was dedicated to keep our guild alive, and was promoted for that.

First and foremost, this is not under any circumstances a direct attack on any Guild, Person etc. If I'm completely wrong, correct me on this, but I'm assuming a "Kardonir" is some high-rank in the actual Kingdom of Arathor in comparison to, for example, a "Diplomat" that is unassociated with the guild. I believe the rather ironic part of that statement is in the fact that, when the guild was first formed, it made itself high and powerful (can't get more "high" and "powerful" than leaders of a rich kingdom) because it was "the first" and, therefore, seemingly had the right to do so - yet, you forbid this person from attempting to create a title that has not yet been adapted by another member of the community?

I must ask (correct me if I'm wrong, as I may be thinking of another "Kingdom of such-and-such" nation that claimed that we should ignore countless wandering mobs in an area), how can the Kingdom of Arathor, who came to power and create a load of useless "server lore", some of which contradicts WoW lore almost completely to allow the survival of their guild concept (i.e. Bloodline etc.), criticise a similar (but somewhat less extreme) attempt from some other random roleplayer? This doesn't just apply to Arathor, though; I point to pretty much every guild that started off as a "famous bunch of nobles" or similar and ask what the difference is between their fame and the position ("Sheriff of a Poor State") this guy is asking. Sure, you may have "earned" that position now, but you sure as hell didn't deserve it at the start.

However, as I said above, I agree with the previous posts - one should not follow the example of these "bad role-model" guilds and usurp power, rather, one should earn it rightfully.

Good morning. I just felt like saying that Kardonir - Liuetenant, rank below the Dank'thar - Warlord, aka, Elegost, whom is inactive due to irl. Someone needs to lead the army, yeah? Isn't a big rank I have, but one I earned. Simply put.

by Guest Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:28 pm

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us, or-

Gunnell, when the Era started you used the motto, "All other guilds will die off, don't talk to them and don't rp with them."

You are an elitist Gunnell and an asshole and i've told people you aren't for way too long..

I think many of you council people and Generals of the ARMY OF STORMWIND is acting elitists.

by **Magaskawee/Anaei** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:31 pm

Victor Soderbergh wrote:
Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us, or-

Gunnell, when the Era started you used the motto, "All other guilds will die off, don't talk to them and don't rp with them."

You are an elitist Gunnell and an asshole and i've told people you aren't for way too long..
I think many of you council people and Generals of the ARMY OF STORMWIND is acting elitists.

In what way exactly? I've never told people their rp is stupid and they should go away and stop trying to rp with me. Also why exactly are you calling titled people elitist when you yourself are trying to gain support for a title..? I don't exactly see the sense here.

by **Kil'drakor** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:33 pm

I'm staying out of this -- the srs factor is way too high. Someone might get hurt. Surprised

EDIT: I just want to make clear that perhaps it would be better for the discussion if some of you guys didn't use any argumentum ad hominem.

by **Raelan** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:34 pm

by **Ataris** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:41 pm

Victor Soderbergh wrote:Anyone that has any objections if I may recieve the title as Sheriff or Marshal of Westfall?
More information etc you will find on Looking for Roleplay.

Sounds like a cool idea. You should try it! Smile

Faralan Thorgint wrote:
I recall Geldar's military commander rank was "given", (or claimed?) to him / by him after the numerous wpvp campaigns he held, and hence actually did something for the community and the rank.

-No one- is granted -anything- authority wise outside their own guild. There is no head of a game community like this, anyone who claims otherwise needs some checking. You earn everything and only from particular individuals(in this case, your guild).

Claiming authority and expecting people to listen outside your guild based on nothing but titles and backstory you've claimed is retarded, and sadly happens far too much on this server for my personal taste.

Geldar wrote:Don't forget to add "Lord of Gilneas" to your list there.

Also, to the OP. Make events, create RP and earn your rank. No one will say anything if you do that.

As long as you keep your authority papers to the guild you're in.

Gunnell wrote:Queen of Stromgarde
Emperor of the Gurubashi
General of Stormwind's Armies
Counciller of Stormwind
Chairman/Lady of Stormwind
Owner of Tyr's Hand
Lord in Gilneas (because everybody and their mother will leap at the chance to call me a hypocrit).

Sorry, but if we're going to leap on the idea of somebody being a Sheriff and call it a bad idea then people need to look at what else they're accepting. Roleplaying 'up to' that role is barely an excuse for me since people will either be given the title by a previous authority without actually doing anything or will host a couple of decent events and claiming they can be Lord-Emperor-General of Kul Tiras.

I, personally do not have an issue with this (that is the Sheriff title, not the above) at all. Provided that it is intended as the stepping stone into beginning more roleplay in Westfall (or elsewhere) and not simply as somebody granting themselves a title for the sake of waving their virtual pixel dick around then what the hoo-harr.

Although, I do think Sheriff would have fit better in the more People's Militia stage (since now its the Westfall Brigade), Stoutmantle is already called the Marshal, no? Still, don't see why we couldn't have another.

Agreed 100%, echoes my thoughts pretty well.

Anaei/Vezullia wrote:
Gunnell wrote:
Yes, like SI:7 and your Assault Rifle wielding Night Elf. Yes, we were certainly arses to your entire group whilst they acted out Splinter Cell. Or Broken Sword, or Kingdom of Stromgarde's gang of IC thugs, or the various Horde RP guilds who swoop in to fight us, or-

Gunnell, when the Era started you used the motto, "All other guilds will die off, don't talk to them and don't rp with them."

You are an elitist Gunnell and an asshole and i've told people you aren't for way too long..

This entire community is more or less based on elitism, what's the point(har har) of pointing fingers at this stage?

Gunnell wrote:
Gilneas is a roleplaying hub whether you like it or not. Is it massive? No, obviously its not the cathedral square but when people claim it isn't.. well, I could list plenty of apparant 'hubs' that are glorified guild meeting spots too.

I've spent some time in Gilneas lately and I can honestly say it's some of the best RP I've had since I started playing this game 6 years ago. Granted, most of it is in-guild but I formed all my ties to the people I still RP with when I wasn't part of it.

RP hub is a very loose term. If you want RP and have reason to pop by though, I think you'll find it well worth the time. There's RP almost every single night around the Mastiff in Keel Harbor or the Blackwald, with very few exceptions.

by **Jayse** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:46 pm

I enjoyed Gilneas, was a good change ^^

by **Ave/Sariella** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:49 pm

Yes, someone has to start with some sort of "title" or whatever when making a guild or somesuch, but it's often never started as the highest rank ever if you know what i mean, from there people has worked their way up over time, i really havent seen much of the "LOL IR KING OF STORMWIND" type thing, just chill out with the flaming and personal attacks in this thread, some of you are taking it way off the subject, Op wanted an opinion but as said above i mostly see personal attacks Mad

As for the actual subject i feel starting with sheriff would be nice enough, possibly working your way up if that's what you want.

by **Valerias** Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:59 pm

Ave wrote:Yes, someone has to start with some sort of "title" or whatever when making a guild or somesuch, but it's often never started as the highest rank ever if you know what i mean, from there people has worked their way up over time, i really havent seen much of the "LOL IR KING OF STORMWIND" type thing.

That, really. I haven't seen anyone waltz in and claim authority and have anyone take them seriously, so I'm not sure what the problem is with people who have titles that are working. I'd be pretty bored if there were no lords or military officers or bishops in the RP community.

I don't think that IC authority to do with guilds, either. Individual roleplayers have the choice to integrate other titled characters (for lack of a better word) into their own roleplay, and I have never seen anyone going around waving papers to say 'I'm a general/lord/bishop/captain, respect my authoriteh!!!111' It's merely that having some characters with recognisable authority, be it a general on the battlefield, a bishop in the Cathedral, or a high priestess in Darnassus, makes some sense and enhances the immersion of the community.

by **Demurral** Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:04 pm

Thought i'd chuck my two pennies in.
When it comes to creating your own guild specifically for RP, I don't see any problem in assuming a title because of doing so. A lowly soldier, recruiting for his cause would not gain the respect needed to keep any other followers in line, and they would naturally become seen as a leader becuase of it. They may be granted the title prematurely, but the responsibility behind it would force them to earn it, or lose respect from the others they represent.

For example, Belserden's Pirate, wait, i mean... Privateer guild. He claimed the title of Captain at the start of it, but has worked within the guild to earn it, earning the respect needed to govern others and issue out orders because of it.

So, to the OP. As long as you earn the title actively, so that others will naturally see you as a leader, and direct others to you, I see no problem in taking the Sheriff title, assuming that you actively earn it from your actions UNDER the title.. if you see what I mean.

by **Geneviève** Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:06 pm

First of all, a friendly dig at a foolish statement Wink

Lieutenant, one rank beneath warlord “Isn't a big rank”? So you’re only Turalyon to Elegost’s Lothar, not a big rank at all! It's important to remember a rank is not what the name implies, but the power/authority/position that rank actually holds. A lieutenant today is a newly commissioned officer, a lieutenent historically was the right hand man of the supreme commander of an army.

Gunnel, I’m sorry to have to undermine your assertion but, OOC we were made to feel particularly unwelcome by certain members of your guild, you included. However I did enjoy my RP there, mostly with my guild and SI:7, which leads me on to my next point.

I don’t think of Gilneas as a hub, as has been said it is a place where your guild meets, along with ***** the mage who has a backstory so complicated and so in flux that I can’t remember whether or not they are a scourge mage or has since been resurrected..or something.

On the topic of titles I have mixed feelings. Whilst I believe any character who has made anything of themselves should be of noble, or at least bourgeoisie birth simply because anybody else doesn’t have the time, or the connections, to make anything of themselves in what I perceive to be a society with low social mobility. Just look at all of Blizzard’s lore heroes. They’re all knights, lords, mages, chieftains etc.

However, within the nobility there is a still a colossal amount of disparity in power/wealth/influence between various ranks. On top of that there are still secondary titles that are often more important in practice, military rank, position within the clergy etc.

I myself ‘claimed’ a rank, nobody gave it to me. It’s very vague ‘Lady’, it’s a very complex title as well, for example: Lady Dieudonne is Lord Dieudonne’s wife, or if he’s unmarried his mother. Lady Genevieve is the unmarried female relation of Lord Dieudonne, or indeed the unmarried female relation of numerous noble ranks. Nobody gave it to me but over time I hope I’ve earned it, if not then I can only hope I’ll do so in the future.

Claiming rank has no hard and fast rules, everyone has their own feelings on the topic and simply has to decide for themselves what is and what is not appropriate. I myself love people claiming titles but despise the sort of characters who fill them, principally military ranks. There are a host of characters on this realm I could name who, if they were in my platoon, would receive such bad reports that they’d never achieve even the rank of Lance-corporal. But that’s just me being stuffy and easily taking offence at the sort of people RPers assume officers to be. Razz

TL;DR/Conclusion

Nobody is EVER going to be able to justify their IC rank on a forum where just one or two people can make an argument last forever. However, I think it’s foolish to try and do so. Justify it in game, with the people you actually RP with. Go out and play that role, and if you do it well people will respect that and respond appropriately. And if they don’t, feel free to set your Perky Pug on them, that’s what Gen does. >.>

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