Super Smash Brothers

Note: Why in K'ure's name was "The Other Game Thread" closed? I loved that thread, and I feel it served a very distinct purpose. I would have posted this in that thread if it was still open. Instead, I'm forced to either take it to the Everchanging Topics thread, where it will get swamped, or open a new thread, which in turn will encourage more flooding. I hope the mods will reconsider and re-open that thread.

Disclaimer: This is going to get geeky. This post is basicly one-half a love letter to Super Smash Brothers and Nintendo, the other half being an advertisement for a specific mod for Brawl. If you're not too fond of Nintendo, I suggest you look the other way for this one. The fanboyism inherent in this might induce nausea.

Anywhoo-.

SUPER SMASH BROTHERRRRRRRRRRRRRS!!!




There's a special place in my heart for this franchise.

Said place is huge. It's a space. It's a huge ass void - it's a whole fucking galaxy of space.

You see, for myself and many others, Super Smash Brothers (Henceforth abberviated as SSB64) was our first "hardcore" gaming experience. I distinctly remember that from the n64 gaming crowd, there were two multiplayer games that were played an asston more than anything else: Goldeneye and SSB64. My household was of the latter type, though I proved my viability with a Klobb more than once. Point is, SSB64 is the first game I played on a semi-daily basis for what must have been over a year, if not longer. If it wasn't for the fact that our cartridge got stolen a good ten years ago, I would have checked the playtime on it - which would have been weeks and weeks in total.

So what's the appeal? The superficial is obvious. This franchise is a love-letter to Nintendo and its franchises. The games are absolutely chock-full of cameos and references, and the appeal of being able to pit Link and Mario together in an epic clash should be instantly recognizable to Nintendo fans. This appeal becomes greater and greater as the franchise progresses – the trophies in melee, and the absolute explosion in Brawl with its completely ridiculous amount of content (stickers, music, demos...I've lost count.) The games also have a very powerful party element. The many items, stages and general silliness make for a great party game.

However, there's more to it than that. If it was just the cameo-richness and party gameplay than that wouldn't explain why this franchise is so much more loved than say, Mario Party. You see, the thing that SSB64 has over Mario Party (and to a lesser extend Kart) is depth and complexity. For a fighting game that looks on the surface as a cheap marketing trick SSB64 overwhelms the players that take their time to invest in it with a surprising amount of depth and balance. It didn't take us long to start tinkering with the settings to make the game more competitive, removing random random and arbitrary elements like items and stages that had a lot of hazards. We quickly made the switch to lives, up from a time limit – to allow for epic long-lasting matches with the highest possible comeback potential.

Unbeknownst to us, many other players underwent a similar transformation – a growth towards the hardcore and competitive. When we started playing against players outside of our own little household sphere, we noticed they all gravitated towards the same kind of stages and settings. Another thing we couldn't help but notice is that the skill-cap and difference between players was actually pretty significant – an expert could beat a novice in a 5-stock match without losing a single life. This aspect – the potential for getting good, the skill-cap – is one of the most important aspect for a competitive game.

It was amazing fun to us budding nerds to actually get good at something like a competitive game. I remember people having mains and secondary characters, practising one or two characters to perfection and routinely switching. Once I picked Ness, you knew I was getting serious!

And then came melee (SSBM).

SSBM was everything that was good about SSB64, only taken up to eleven. More characters, more viable stages, more settings to tinker with, and even a tournament mode! Even more so than its predecessor, SSBM was a must-have for every NGC owner, even to the point that not-having it was considered a cardinal gaming sin. It had no true competition on it's system: it was the competitive NGC game. A peek around the internet will show you to what ridiculous extremes this game has been mastered. Every single frame is utilized – even glitches have become techniques in the hands of the pros. Though it never got the recognition of a, say, Starcraft or Halo, it had – or has – a very lively tournament scene with a decent amount of cash pumped into it. When Brawl (SSBB)was announced, you can bet your papoose we were excited as hell. We were expecting the next logical step up from SSBM, and the marketing for the game sure was looking promising enough!

We were however sorely disappointed.

Though SSBB absolutely burst and brimmed at the rims with Nintendo loving, cameos and content, the competitive edge was dulled somewhat. The most obvious and notorious symptom of this is tripping. In SSBB, your character occasionally just trips without warning or logic – and unlike items or stage hazards, this isn't an arbitrary element you can eliminate. Besides this particular thorn in our sides, the balance also seemed to be skewed – Meta-knight completely dominated the competitive scene unlike any character in SSBM had. It was a very bitter tragedy. For all of its magnificent content it had to offer, SSBB was a disappointment to the competitive community. All of these fancy graphics, stages, new characters and music – all of this was lost on the competitive community. Many players, including myself, decided to stick with SSBM instead.

But...what if? What if there was a way to fix all of this? What if there was a way to reverse the gravity back to how it was in melee, making the characters less floaty and easier to juggle and make combos? What if tripping could be removed? What if the character roster could be balanced?

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you:

Project M



(The attempts to make SSB related media seem badass and "tough" always cracks me up. Colorful characters chucking turnips at eachother backed by Hans Zimme-esque trailer fanfares. Glorious.)

Official website

Project M began as a simple project to import Melee physics in Brawl and remove any arbitrary elements – but it has since transcended that. It also adds some stages from the N64 that have been begging for a comeback (Hyrule Castle N64!) and some other neat things, like splitting the pokémon trainer up into three different characters. There's even some stages that were never playable in singleplayer - like the N64 Metal Mario stage - and entirely new ones, like a Castlevania stage - which are all viable for competetive matches.

The best thing though is that it doesn't even require any hacking or modification to your console – you need only to download the files to a SD card and load the mod trough the Brawl stage builder. As of this post, the project entered the Beta stage in the America and Japan regions. Sadly, a PAL version has not been made available yet – but I await it with much anxiety. The potential of an active modding community polishing the game as it goes like say Blizzard polishes and refines the balance in Starcraft II as it develops is bliss to a competitive community.

So there you have it, my (overly long) love-letter to Super Smash Brothers and a little advertisement for this neat little mod I can't wait to try out. So how about you, Defias Brotherhood? Any fond memories if this franchise? Considering how wide-spread it was back in my heyday, I can't imagine there are no other people on here that haven't at least tried it.

Oh god. This game. I remember playing it on Nintendo 64 with my friends when I was like.. 10 years old or something. Then, turned out a friend of mine had it on his Wii. I was so happy.

Eowale wrote:Oh god. This game. I remember playing it on Nintendo 64 with my friends when I was like.. 10 years old or something. Then, turned out a friend of mine had it on his Wii. I was so happy.

Haha I was the same! I have yet to play any of the latest ones since the N64 one, though tempted to buy a Wii just for this game.. AND MARIO PARTY!

SHEIK.

All I need to win.

I love how some people try make it into a 'proper' competitive game... It makes me shake my head, wondering why people don't put their time into games that are actually meant to be balanced and competitive.

Coppersocket wrote:I love how some people try make it into a 'proper' competitive game... It makes me shake my head, wondering why people don't put their time into games that are actually meant to be balanced and competitive.

Like World of Warcraft?

It's a testimony on how great a game is if it can be both enjoyed as a casual party game and as a competetive tournament game. Who are you to decide what games are "meant" to be balanced and competetive? Is something meant ot be balanced and competetive only when the designer says it is? Once it's released, it's up to the players to play the game as they please. This franchise has proven itself over the years to have the potential to be played competetively, just as much potential as other fighting games.

The difference being that Smash is much more fun due to its party roots!

Khendran/Galedric wrote:

Thelos wrote:Note: Why in K'ure's name was "The Other Game Thread" closed?

Hi.

Wierd, when I searched for it, I could have sworn it looked locked. I must have been mistaken, or, you know crazy.

If the mods so desire, this thread can be merged into it, then.

But isn't it obvious Thelos? My opinion is obviously better than everyone else's, so when people want to do something I don't approve of, they're instantly wrong. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a fact.

Talking back to me, disagreeing against me, general negativity which I just don't agree with, is obviously heresy and anyone who speaks such deserves the most ruthless punishment...
Get stuck in a room with 3 feral 'futa' draenei half elven worgen illidans.


On a more serious note, I'm well aware that people will try to make almost anything into a competition, however SSB was designed to be a party game, not a competitive fighter.

First game I played, on my older cousin's N64.
Loved it

Coppersocket wrote:
On a more serious note, I'm well aware that people will try to make almost anything into a competition, however SSB was designed to be a party game, not a competitive fighter.

Designs be damned! What do we care what something was designed for? If I want to use a fork to scratch my back, there's no stopping me!

All this talk is making me itchy for more smashy. I need to get the band back together some time soon for a classical night of nintendo geekery.

I loved playing 64 and Melee. Typically used Link, Marth, Mewtwo, Zelda, or Falco. And I often played it competitively. <.< Which made it less fun to play my main chars with friends because I'd always dominate them. >.>

Still haven't played Brawl. Sounds like I haven't missed much.

I have a nintendo magazine (for some reason) with a Brawl overview, and it just looks too... different. The original was simple and awesome, and will always be the most fun Nintendo has ever given me.
Someone buy me a cheap N64 and a copy of the game now!

Stop playing mario and come RP Thelos!

Drustai wrote:I loved playing 64 and Melee. Typically used Link, Marth, Mewtwo, Zelda, or Falco. And I often played it competitively. <.< Which made it less fun to play my main chars with friends because I'd always dominate them. >.>

Still haven't played Brawl. Sounds like I haven't missed much.

You have and you haven't - while Brawl was filled to the brim with content, it was a step down from melee when it comes to core competetive gameplay.

This while Project M business is promising to rectify that, and then some. I was so dissapointed in melee to find out that Hyrule Castle wasn't one of the playable N64 stages, but Project M is actually including it! It looks glorious.

In N64 I mostly played Ness and 'oll Kirbster. Those two, especially the former, got nerfed into the ground in Melee though, so I ended up playing with Shiek and Samus, and sometimes with Young Link and Peach. Oh, and I had a secret crush on Bowser, too. I love that big lug. Hard to be exactly competetive but he's got some wiley tricks and when you actually connect some of those big hits its oh-so-statisfying.



I so want this.

Edit:
There's apperantly a whole world of Brawl hacks out there. Supposedly most of them are aweful, like ye old wc3 and SC custom maps, but like those, some are bound to be hidden gems. It looks like a fun thing to experiment with.

Super Smash Bros and Pokemon Puzzle League are the only two games I've vowed to keep around forever and the only reason I still think of my N64 as one of my greatest treasures! (also, the main reason I found it bearable to lose my PS2)

I'm positive this is the first game I ever played...
It was amazing.

I played these five games on Nintendo 64:
Mario Kart.
Pokémon Stadium.
Super Smash Bro's.
Super Mario.
The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.

Drustai wrote:I loved playing 64 and Melee. Typically used Link, Marth, Mewtwo, Zelda, or Falco. And I often played it competitively. <.< Which made it less fun to play my main chars with friends because I'd always dominate them. >.>

Still haven't played Brawl. Sounds like I haven't missed much.

The fail lies in that they removed Mewtwo. The bastards had awesome throws.

Eowale wrote:I played these five games on Nintendo 64:
Mario Kart.
Pokémon Stadium.
Super Smash Bro's.
Super Mario.
The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.

No Ocarina of Time, Goldeneye64, or Perfect Dark? For shame!

Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:The fail lies in that they removed Mewtwo. The bastards had awesome throws.

I heard. Fuckers.

I consider Super Smash Brothers Melee one of the best games ever made, and has often used it's design properties to illustrate that a great game doesn't have to be overly complicated to be competitive on multiple levels. It's accessible enough to be able to be picked up by anyone, but competitive enough to still be played vigorously a decade later.

It's strength, as far as I'm concerned, is it's simple, unified control scheme. Every character is controlled in the same way, the moves they trigger just vary. Aside from that it makes great use of the game space, due to nintendo platformer roots, the fight doesn't just stay on the flat surface but takes to the skies.

The amount of hours me, Thelos, and many of our friends have clocked in this game is preposterous.

Hell, I keep a gamecube and four controllers behind my TV, SSBM locked and ready to shred. Just in case "It's time". When I introduced the game into my current household (which is populated by game design students, mind you) everyone thought it was a silly game for kids. Untill they got into it.

Yub. This game is awesome. Just one little notch below "Rollercoaster Tycoon" on my list of most epic games of all time

erwtenpeller wrote:I consider Super Smash Brothers Melee one of the best games ever made, and has often used it's design properties to illustrate that a great game doesn't have to be overly complicated to be competitive on multiple levels. It's accessible enough to be able to be picked up by anyone, but competitive enough to still be played vigorously a decade later.

It's strength, as far as I'm concerned, is it's simple, unified control scheme. Every character is controlled in the same way, the moves they trigger just vary. Aside from that it makes great use of the game space, due to nintendo platformer roots, the fight doesn't just stay on the flat surface but takes to the skies.

The amount of hours me, Thelos, and many of our friends have clocked in this game is preposterous.

Hell, I keep a gamecube and four controllers behind my TV, SSBM locked and ready to shred. Just in case "It's time". When I introduced the game into my current household (which is populated by game design students, mind you) everyone thought it was a silly game for kids. Untill they got into it.

Yub. This game is awesome. Just one little notch below "Rollercoaster Tycoon" on my list of most epic games of all time

I can just imagine you every so often texting three friends with simply
"It's time."
And you all gather in a secret location and break out the brawl

Lyniath wrote:break out the brawl

BLASPHEMOUS DOG!!!

We break out Melee!

Drustai wrote:No Ocarina of Time, Goldeneye64, or Perfect Dark? For shame!

Shit, forgot Goldeneye! I was so shit at that though. My pal kept owning me with the crossbow-thing.

erwtenpeller wrote:

Lyniath wrote:break out the brawl

BLASPHEMOUS DOG!!!

We break out Melee!

I mixed them up xD I'm not a nintendo person