Yo Dawg! We heard you got some political correctness!

Geldar wrote:

I've seen maybe Saihna (For creating it anyway) Nyan, Farseer Taldeer and Geldar (with the recent topic by Farglade) actually do something or at least wag their finger at something for a minor reason.

The mod crew has done their job quite well so far in maintaining some order within this forum, you might not be aware of that but we have our own seperate section in the forum where stuff is discussed as well as individuals and what is done with them when they cause trouble. Mostly it is discussed via PM`s or direct intervention in threads, but you will not see a public lynch if that is what you are aiming for.

I think what the quoted individual meant is that some people were given the moderator rank and then disappeared for quite a while. Their last login, for some of them, was weeks ago and they've shown no indication of "moderating" as much as other moderators. I've checked a few of these individuals out in the Memberlist and their activity--or lack thereof--has been surprising. These elected moderators haven't really offered anything to the forums themselves and their "Last Login" can be seen on the Memberlist.

I don't think this was a comment directed to the active moderators, but more along the lines of pointing out that some people might have been given the moderator rank a bit too quickly, considering their sparse contribution to the forum.

Huggles, Geldar. <3

Yes! The moderator crew has done... quite well... Indeed..
*sweats as he looks down, Geldar's chainsword on his throat*
They do a.. Oh god.. They do a good job every day!
*Takes a deep breath and rubs his forehead -where now a stamp saying "Heretic" is- in a panicky way*
Furthermore, the emperor will... Will honestly lead us all, the imperial cult is... Is the one true religion!
*Sobs and cries a little as the chainsword roars menacingly*

In other news: I should play less Dawn of War :<

Then play more Dawn of War 2!

I've no problem with the moderators, I think you do a great job and I'm sure whatever Gorge posted was offensive and needed to be deleted. However it's utter bull if you don't do that to the Christian video's, you or any other moderator Geldar might not have found them offensive therefore none sprang into action but in my opinion ANY thing pointing and laughing at religion in ANY way isn't suitable for the forum. It has the potential to really hurt someone feelings regardless if what it is, NOONE has the right to judge anyone else's religion in anyway. Don't do double standards Geld just because you personally didn't find the Christian video's offensive, not your job to moderate to your opinion but make this forum a safe and non offensive place for everyone.

Personally myself I never saw the Islam picture, but the doughnut one that Rhebeca posted I cant really see how that is offensive. all she said was thats what she was brought up with even if it was a joke she was just proveing the point that the ammericans managed to relate doughnuts to god that is all.

Also about the Moderators, I think they are doing a fine job you cant expect them to watch the forum 24/7 as they have things they want to do. Also some one mentioned that the Moderators are Saihna's friends, and whats the problem with that obviusly she trust's them thats why she made those people Moderators, You would all be the first to complain if you had some one like Blacksage moderating.

So all I can say is just think before posting things that is all from my behalf. I dont see the point in this thread other then to complain all you do when you post threads like these is make Moderators waste there time. You could of Just used the personal message feature instead of them having to check every post to make sure it doesnt contain crap. In all honestly threads like this should just get locked straight away, because it isnt really anything other then QQ.

There is a line that you don't cross when it comes to what is, and what isn't suitable for a public forum.

Religion is a good basis for that line, the christian videos may be hilarious and silly beyond words but they still cross that line. The muslim thing, what ever it was, obviously crossed that line -alot- more than the christian videos. Nevertheless, as I said earlier, regardless of the rank allocated to the two posts, they both cross the line and poke fun at -someones- religion, which shouldn't be allowed.

A few responses.

Nyg, I haven't seen the video in question, so I cannot give you a view of my own. However, from Geldar's sayings, it was not because it was about Muslims, but because its content was highly offensive. There is a line between "fun"/"humour" and insulting. From my understanding, that thread crossed the line blatantly and it would have been locked/deleted regardless of the actual religion it was directed at, be it Islam or Christianity or Paganistic or Worshippers of Tin-Tin. It's exactly because we're not uptight that we don't go around deleting and censoring everything. If this was deleted, it means it was over the top.

On Fel's view of the thread, allow me to disagree. This thread was a direct attemt to attack moderating, there was absolutely no hint of being directed to "inactive moderators", quite the opposite. Any and all "attacks" and "bites" so far, have been towards active moderators, mostly myself and Geldar.

On Gunnel's perception about active and inactive moderators, I'll accept it when he provides me with a decent and detailed explanation on how he can have any idea about Moderator Forum posts and Administration Control Panel activity. Until he does so (which he doesn't), he makes up facts out of his own behind, which is not appreciated the least bit. I (and the other moderators) am perfectly in a position to know which moderators are active and which aren't - or if they have a reason for that. Gunnel isn't. Only thing Gunnel is in a position to know, is how many posts Moderators have done, and when their last login was. That's all, really. Nothing giving him a right to have any opinion whatsoever, on moderators' activity or lack of.

On Veia's post, I am not in a position to know about anyone but myself; I don't see how I could be tagged as "Saihna's friend", when we hadn't even spoken for over a year. Heck, most of those who speak of "Saihna's friends" have been a LOT closer to Saihna, for FAR more and FAR more recently than I have. Just for the record

Overall, that's a lovely bunch of "police" type images in this thread. If you do want Ge.Sta.Po. type of moderating so you will understand what you accuse us of, it can be easily arranged, don't worry. Hardly what would be required to keep a forum mature and nice, I think, is it? As Geldar said, be a bit more mature about your behaviour in these forums, have manners, don't spam mindlessly, think about what you're saying, keep it nice and clean. Then moderators would have a lot less work. And since we are not exactly getting paid for the work done, less work would be more than welcome. Not exactly our fault if someone fails to behave decently.

Sadly, a handful of specific individuals insist on testing their limits.
Gladly, they do have limits. Whether they like them or not, is none of my concern personally.

Go ahead, hate all you want, but as long as I'm a moderator here, I will not submit to clumsy attempts of bullying. Yes, this thread's lock was not my call, I didn't even see it before it was locked. But also yes, I can recognize the type of anti-mod "propaganda". If you want to keep poking the dogs, be my guest. Don't cry when they bite, though. Because when you exhaust all good will and patience, and cross the line, you will get bitten and you'll only have yourself to blame.

Nayan wrote:A few responses.

Nyg, I haven't seen the video in question, so I cannot give you a view of my own. However, from Geldar's sayings, it was not because it was about Muslims, but because its content was highly offensive. There is a line between "fun"/"humour" and insulting. From my understanding, that thread crossed the line blatantly and it would have been locked/deleted regardless of the actual religion it was directed at, be it Islam or Christianity or Paganistic or Worshippers of Tin-Tin. It's exactly because we're not uptight that we don't go around deleting and censoring everything. If this was deleted, it means it was over the top.

Well I didn't see the video either, however I'm still firmly in the postion that anything poking and laughing at religion in anyway, shouldn't be here including the muslim video and the christianity video's. I never stated it was only deleted because it was about muslims, but that it proberly offended Geldar hence the immediate deletion rather than the votes I believe happen on the Mod forum.

I understand that you're not uptight about everything and that you rather allow people to have freedom of speech, so I'll let it slide but seriously, religion isn't something to be laughed at in -ANY- context. Alas as it is, I'll leave you Mod's to do the grand job that you do.

I wish people in general would try a bit harder to not be offensive. I am usually not easy to offend but I easily feel a need to stand up and shout out when I feel someone might be stepping on others toes. This thread to me is one of those. Religious matters or anything else, give the mods a break. Any offensive, bad humour, mean spiting words, if you seek to be heard and listened to take it in a mature way, through a pm, a whisper or what ever. Positing things that is nothing but negative or offensive to get attention, does not belong on this forum in my eyes. If there is a great need for such, make an own forum for it.. For really it is wasting the mods time, patience, other peoples time and shows a genuin lack of respect to other people. It may be just a game but there are and will always be people behind the screen. Internet is a tool, internet is not face to face. The written word may mean little and hurt little to some, but hurt deeply and more easily be missunderstood to others.

Show some more caution and care.

I did get to see the video before it was removed, I simply shook my head and thought that: "Hey thats just one more piece of humor I simply do not get as I do not have that kind of humor. Be it against Christians or Muslims I did not get offended by what I saw, I simply found it way out of my leauge and need to watch"

Nayan wrote:A few responses.
On Veia's post, I am not in a position to know about anyone but myself; I don't see how I could be tagged as "Saihna's friend", when we hadn't even spoken for over a year. Heck, most of those who speak of "Saihna's friends" have been a LOT closer to Saihna, for FAR more and FAR more recently than I have. Just for the record

Well I dont know if people know her or not Im just saying that it doesnt matter if they are friends or not

As far as I know the people who was made Moderators have either done somthing for the community or just been up for the task.

also I think this needs popping up again

Ataris wrote:Forum Rules

Welcome to the Defias Brotherhood Role-Playing forums! To make sure everyone has a pleasant time we have a few rules in place.

• First and foremost, these forums are created by roleplayers for roleplayers. If you have no interest in roleplaying, you have no reason to be part of these forums.
  
• Please register with your character name.
  
• Do not be afraid to introduce yourself to the community! We welcome new roleplayers.
  
• The moderators might want to talk to you in-game before activating your account. This is to ensure no one registers with malicious or destructive intents.
  
• Rude behaviour is not tolerated. Any posts deemed so by the moderators will be removed and you will recieve a warning and ultimately a ban.
  
• Be open and willing to hold an open discussion. If you happen to offend someone on a personal level, apologize. Keep it clean.
  
• Spam, pornography and otherwise inappropriate subjects will not be tolerated.
  

The rules are subject to change and may be updated at any time.

Hell, if people are nitpicking over stuff just for the sake of it maybe we should start moderating these forums like the realm forum, suspensions for insultive words and questionable content of posts aswell as trolling and whatnot. And yes, the comic was really offensive, entirely diferent than Rhebeca`s clip which was light humoured, but people enjoy nitpicking for the sake of it.

The comic was removed because it was both utterly offensive, against the ruleset of these forums and that it was causing a flame war between the posters, concerning that i dont see why should i explain further why it was removed, if you have something else to get off your chests on why you feel you are treated unfair go ahead, but the rulesets stay and we will stick to enforcing them.

Sensitive content like that will not be tolerated, speaking of racism, religion, or any form of other minority insults aswell as general insults and offensive content and trolling/flooding attempt. People can whine as much as they want, the mods will continue to do their job.

Nayan wrote:On Fel's view of the thread, allow me to disagree. This thread was a direct attemt to attack moderating, there was absolutely no hint of being directed to "inactive moderators", quite the opposite. Any and all "attacks" and "bites" so far, have been towards active moderators, mostly myself and Geldar.

Considering it was a bit late when I read that post, and after having re-read it a few times, I'll go ahead and retract my first impression and agree with you. I realize now that I read it wrong.

But I will point out that there really are some moderators that were given the rank but have barely been here.

We wouldn't be having this discussion if people spend less time on spamming and trying to convince others how witty and funny they are.

Perhaps it's time to take the stance that the purpose of this forum isn't what it has been moving towards lately?

/grumpyorc

I have to agree. For starters, there is way too much witty image spamming going on in threads that don't really concern said images. Or was -- anyway, it was quite a nuisance.

The moderators were in their full right to shut that thread down: it's stated in the forum policy that offensive material will not be tolerated. And as such it's totally legit to remove posts that contain that kind of material. The only remark I have to make is that there should not be differences between e.g. mockery of islam and christendom, but that has been adressed already.

The purpose of this forum in to get aquainted, and to provide a community to RPers. For me, posting funny images provides a better way to that goal than RP discussions about armor or if character x godemotes or not.

General chat > Not serious.
Rest of the Forum > Serious.

I think a lot of people would lose interest here if they only can read where and when RP events will be, and reading just message boards of people asking for others to roll level 1s to be sacrificed to demons.

Like I said, it's okay, as long as people don't do it in threads that do have a more serious note. Maybe you don't like to get involved in those discussions, but other people might.

And I honestly don't see how posting an image from 4chan makes you more acqainted with each other.

Ofcourse, the "Stay on topic"-role isn't there for funsies. And for the image posting, if you're with friends out drinking, do you have serious discussions all the time, or do you tap some jokes every now and then? If not, fyl :p

Archal, as far as I can see, this is by no means a "cut all fun, DIS IZ SRS BSNS ONLY!!!" matter. This is more a concern that "hey, hang on a sec, this is going on far more than it should". I sincerely doubt anyone here would imply we are merely here to "discuss RP", we're not scientists examining a dead bug ffs, we're all young people with a common interest being Roleplaying. Ofc we will make jokes, ofc we will tease each other, ofc we will be silly. The point is that being silly in 99.99999% of the active topics isn't really any more healthy than not being silly at all.

And when we take things responsibly towards one another, we can also step back and say "yeah, sorry, I went out of line. my bad." and leave it at that, without having to turn it into drama.

This is where moderators (and a fairly large chunk of non-moderators who have noticed it) have a complaint. Some people don't seem to be able to admit their bad and keep decent, instead they try to react/start a revolution/mock/flame whenever they are told they are out of line. Which mathematically will lead to to them "winning" nothing more than bans for violating forum rules, trolling and making moderators' (already heavier than normal posters' ) task even harder.

I agree with Renhali, give them a break. People shouldn't post things like that full stop. Including the christian video's, nit picking or not, I find it offensive that you'd allow -ANY- content that may or may not offend someones religion regardless of the job the Mod's do silly people post silly things and if they do, it is the job of the Mod's to remove it. It's not just for the sake of nit picking, it's perfectly on topic as this thread was about a Mod deleting a religiously offensive thread, christian piss take videos are just that.

I'm agnostic, certainly not christian but you cannot ignore it whilst also deleting things like the muslim comic. Double standards are a no no.

End of conversation, as I repeat. -ANY- content that may or may not offend someones religion, it is NOT the place for this forum to point and laugh at it. Whether it be a silly concept of christianity and doughnuts, or an offensive comic on islam.

Obviously just my opinion but I can't really see any space for a differ in thoughts.

TBH, pretty much any content is going to offend someone's religion.

It's the moderator's jobs to decide if something is offensive enough to warrant removal. Since there's not even a decent general guideline for this, it'll come down to personal opinion every time. I don't think they're doing a bad job. I do think that knee-jerk finger pointing of abuse of power when they do their job is uncalled for, childish and disrespectful.

Hardly if it's completely unrelated to religion...Besides, that video was on the forum with the distinct purpose of taking the piss out of it. Which is wrong at the end of the day.

May I use this chance to actually say that I am not disagreeing with the what the Mod's do, what they've done or anything alike. I do -not- agree with the original intention of this thread, nor the one that is made to QQ over. I am however using this thread as a chance to show my thoughts about certain content, that to my opinion shouldn't be here.

Note, I also requested to Geldar that the post's regarding the Alteracian's RSP, that specifically points and laughs at it be removed to spare her feelings. I've yet to receive a reply to whether the Mod's decided to remove them or leave them be, as Geldar said he would discuss it with them.

Oh and as childish as this thread is, remember all authority should be free to be criticised and questioned. All this thread does is give the Mod's a chance to perfectly justify themselves, even if they don't really need to.

I wasn't addressing you directly Nygarth, sorry if it came over that way. I've added some line breaks to try and clear it up.

All authority should be questioned, but that's not a blanket green-light stating that it's OK to go 'Why?' over and over again until authority is paralysed with having to defend themselves. Sarcastic little 'omg, they're oppressors! Hark at the oppressors oppressing me' posts the instant an authority figure actually exercises their authority is childish, uncalled for and disrespectful, and that's basically what happened with the creation of this thread.

Directly, I agree. Indirectly, however it's allowed many to voice greater problems they had with the Moderators, and hopefully get them resolved.