Re: Inner-conflict. The " Essence " of Roleplay.

by **Jeanpierre** Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:59 pm

Amaryl wrote:where have you been the past years?

We could ask that question to Bennedictus... Razz

But I agree. And I'm sure we don't mean entirely different things. I just mean to say that, within this community of, say 100 people, Fortesgue might be well known and it's natural for these 100 people to see him as "the bishop". And one can RP as having had another circle of 100 people where he was known as "The Bishop" (even though none are actually RP'd on this server). And he'll have to work and get to know new people in -this- community if he wants to fiddle around a bishop title on Fortesgue's turf.
Just as an example really. I'm certainly not promoting the concept.

To some extent, at least, we have to be flexible about our history and lore to accommodate other people. As plain as examples come: birthplaces and where characters have grown up. I bumped into many players that 'were borned and raised' in the same town as one of my chars but I have never seen before.

At least I think the words in this discussion describe a greater difference than our views are. I'll just rest my case Wink

I'm sure we're not seeing things so differently.

by **Nithel** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:10 pm

I dislike server lore and continuity in that regard. It brings forth boring stalemates where people have to restrict themselves and have to keep their creativity within borders.

It's like when you buy a house of an uncle. You've known the house your entire life as decorated by said uncle. And it's hard to think outside those lines and imagine how you can make the house look your own now that it's yours. It's not a tabula rasa. Not to mention the restriction of can't-do's that are everywhere.

by **Amaryl** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:14 pm

Nithel wrote:I dislike server lore and continuity in that regard. It brings forth boring stalemates where people have to restrict themselves and have to keep their creativity within borders.

its really mean we can't rp daywalking vampires in wow?

by **Nithel** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:18 pm

That's not what I meant and you know it xD

Server lore ≠ blizzard lore.

by **Nithel** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:23 pm

That's not what I meant and you know it xD

Server lore ≠ blizzard lore.

by **Amaryl** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:27 pm

Nithel wrote:That's not what I meant and you know it xD

Server lore ≠ blizzard lore.

True, but that doesn't mean i have to accept someone's claim of being the bastard child of thrall and jaina either? just like I can't take a claim seriously about someone being the Bishop of Stormwind for the past 15 years without getting an answer to the question: where were you the past 5 years?

if that answer happens to be "I was here, working in this cathedral" Then Amy's opinion would immediately be that the bishop is a lazy, incompetent idiot. while if he was a priest from northshire, just appointed to Stormwind as a bishop she'd give him the benefit of the doubt.

on the same hand I don't expect people to take Amy's claims at face-value either if they've never met before. Neither do I need people to think that she's all pious and stuff, just because I say it is so, due to her back-story.

by **Ledgic** Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:38 pm

I think people's reactions OOC'ly to anyone's IC claims if they don't know them are going to be taken with a heap of salt. I've mountains of backstory on Ledgic and his clan, yet if people start RP'ing folk in Duskwood and have no knowledge of the clan, I can hardly force it on them.

RP'ers will have usually have an ego-driven sense of worth for their characters regardless of how long they've been around, or what they're claiming to be. It's an unfortunate side effect of RP, especially in this sort of setting.

by **Zhakiri** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:00 pm

In regards to IC claims I think the biggest one of all would have to be the adapations to the Monarchy of Stromgarde.

Something I have always thought is that, as much as it enriches, the IC claim can be disregarded, questioned and attacked as much as any other IC claim be it your rank as Bishop or Clan Caan but this 'attack' should be IC. You can take the claim with a pinch of salt OOCly, but when it comes down to it, IC is IC.

The thing with IC claims however is that you as a Character have no reason to disbelieve them. It comes down to Swinburne's Principles of Credulity and Testimony.

by **Amaryl** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:10 pm

Nygarth/Orthur wrote:

The thing with IC claims however is that you as a Character have no reason to disbelieve them. It comes down to Swinburne's Principles of Credulity and Testimony.

*shudder*

by **Zhakiri** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:25 pm

You be quiet! Swinburne is amazing!

by **Lavian** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:31 pm

Amaryl wrote:
Nygarth/Orthur wrote:

The thing with IC claims however is that you as a Character have no reason to disbelieve them. It comes down to Swinburne's Principles of Credulity and Testimony.
*shudder*

*shudder*

by **Zhakiri** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:34 pm

So I'm the only lover of Swinburne here? Heretics, all of you! Go lose yourself in "The God Delusion"! <.<

by **Valerias** Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:36 pm

I personally really enjoy server lore, but then I am one of those who tends to take up interest in places without a tonne of lore-background as regards culture. Tanaris! Alterac! But it seems to me that room for human invention is absolutely necessary for a game like WoW, wherein there is interesting lore, yes, but hardly exhaustive (or even always consistent) lore.

In terms of individual characters... As the game world is large, and consisting of multiple regions and lands and cultures, it's especially easy for those who play humans to have had noteworthy backgrounds in other places, yet come into Stormwind, for example, and be little known. (Perhaps that's why we have so many Lordaeron exiles tongue

)

Also, there's nothing wrong with a little communication when worlds collide. Take Northshire Abbey. I've said that ICly Rohwyn was raised there and her aunt is a priestess there (noobish I know, but first character, etc etc). I've come across at least two other people who've similar stories and I don't have a problem with just assuming they all know each other a little bit, and I've had a positive response, IC, from comments like 'Oh you live at Northshire Abbey? My aunt Thelreda is a priestess, do you know her?'... 'Why yes, a fine woman, I believe.'

TL;DR: Backgrounds will come into conflict every now and then, but I've seen very few cases of it causing actual problems. Server lore helps to widen the RP possibilities. And Azeroth is so vast that there should be plenty of regions/countries/tribes/villages/cultures for everyone's characters to come from.

by **Geneviève** Fri Apr 01, 2011 4:11 pm

But if we follow the logic of 'no server lore' to it's conclusion there will be LESS creativity, i.e. zero, not more. Without adding to server lore my character can't perform ANY action, speak to ANYONE, be seen by ANYONE etc...

Without server lore we'd have no Chapter, no KoA, no Circle, no Cartel.

I assume I've misunderstood you somewhere but I really can't see how you could subscribe to that opinion.

by **Osmand** Fri Apr 01, 2011 4:45 pm

Geneviève wrote:
Jeanpierre wrote:
Imagine watching a LOTR movie marathon for a whole weekend, and at the end of the weekend, well.. still nothing happened cause they are still discussing tea and the first page of the introduction on hobbits. Imagine how slow you'd have to read to actually make the story span over the same RL timeline as the timeline of the characters.

Well if you read the books they're a little like that. A hobbit can't even walk to market without first observing and explaining in great detail precisely what event shaped a particular group of mountains, where a local species of flower got it's name, or composing a poem about a notable rock they discovered nearby. As Tolkein says in the prologue the chief problem with the books is that they are too short. Not enough space to describe the Misty Mountains in full! D:

But that is the chief problem. The Seal's political clash with the Shields after Barean's escape is an excellent example. One day there was chaos, the next day the Shields were meeting with the Shields and Falrock was imprisoned, the next day he was free, the next day the Seal had gone into self imposed exile whilst the council decided what was to be done etc. That month away from Stormwind was more than long enough from an OOC point of view, but from an IC point of view was it really long enough to launch a full investigation into what had happened, who was to blame, what was to be done? Probably not. Concessions have to be made somewhere and I think everyone would prefer things happened quickly rather than dragged on for years.

Sort of off topic, the first day I rolled on DFB to check it out I stumbled across the Chapter's trial and my character offered his services. His plan to defend the Chapter was quite simple. Demand that every individual members be tried seperately, and each charge proven seperately. Simply put, make the trial stretch on for so long the prosecution would die before it was concluded.

So it was you who was that pesky person asking me to defend us in whispers !
Ohh now it is all clear.

by **Geneviève** Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:03 pm

Oh le noes, discovered!

by **Osmand** Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:04 pm

I wish I let you do it now Sad

by **Valerias** Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:46 pm

You... weren't talking to me, were you, Gen?

by **Gesh** Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:17 pm

This topic was created for the discussion of personality perks and flaws aswell as moral queries involving your charecters.

Not about the importance or stupidity of " Server lore. ".

Stop derailing!
Leave that to Mitchell and his little box tunnel 20!

by **Geneviève** Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:07 pm

No, Vale, not you. I'll stay on topic in future. Very Happy

by **Gesh** Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:30 pm

Has anyone had trouble making their charecters far to similar without even attempting to do so. I mean, Vectoria has a neice a living High elf who was infact the one who put her warlock days to an end with a pillar of holy fire. But she seems to share Vectoria's same wrath and hunger for power, albeit in a more lawful manner.

Does anyone feel like giveing me some examples of other paths I could take her down, currently she's recovering from her battle with Vectoria.

by **teirzul** Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:05 pm

you could allways take her down the path of a teacher while she heals?

by **Gesh** Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:11 pm

Well, That's the idea i'm striveing for now. Since her first conflict with Vectoria, both were left heavily wounded. Vectoria was dead infact. Vaesandra pretty much burn't to a crisp.

I like the idea of Vaesandra being abit of a Matyr. Definately the plated saint. She's consideraly more collected and calm them Vectoria now, but has the same temper against personal injustice.

by **Ledgic** Sat Apr 02, 2011 11:54 pm

I wouldn't say I've really had any problems making my characters too similar. There may have been a slight similarity between two of them, but they were father and son, and it was rather difficult to seperate them entirely.

Best way to avoid it is to simply have your characters all be doing entirely different things. Walking seperate paths is a good start, then you can build an entirely different personality.

by **Krogon Devilstep** Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:59 pm

Krogon is a very simple to explain with his inner conflicts i believe. He has many old grudges in regards to the fate of his mate, his incarceration by the alliance, and even so more regarding Warlocks and the curse they brought upon the orcish race. Bloodlust was a big part of him, something i have slowly drained away with time, bumps in the road and mistakes slowly ebbing away his aggressions as he turns toward a more spiritual and patient path. but the old, buried hatreds remain... if well restrained.

Sulthar however is a whole different kettle of fish. How do you create conflict in a being who's only wakeing thought is that of blind rage and revenge? you mask it in sideous restraint and calm cruelty. Sulthar doesnt sleep, he doesnt sit idle doing nothing, always thinking, planning, prepairing, training, mastering and extending control. He has immense potential to become a deeply conflicted individual, but to allow that would mean some immense 'cracks' in his actions and agenda, and his agenda is very, very clear. Kill them, Kill them all... and dont stop until every last single one of them has payed.

So yeah, Krogon is your typical, pensive orc trying to repent for deeds a lifetime ago... but sulthar... we shall see, the Wraithlord needs time to develop, or perhaps not at all, which may add to his persona.

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