Common sense or is it just too good to be true.

Izaa wrote:Unless I'm wrong it's near impossible to even "teleport" anything or one to an unknown location. The mage performing the teleport would have to know.

Actually the random and chaotic nature of Arcane magic means that teleporting something to a specific location is the hard part. That's why you need a Portal Anchor to safely teleport to a city, for example, without ending up inside a wall or off a ledge.

Izaa practically summarised my points when this developed onto Skype last night.

The fact that people went away from that RP thinking no wrong OOC until they found out about the OOC whisper-drama is just proof to the fact that Alistar didn't make it clear.

With all things, a bit of OOC communication solves it. Vaell also knew where he sent the key fragment but I was never pressed in any regard.

Just to make it clear, it was my character that dropped the item, i was stood directly in front of cathee.

I was aware of -no- plot to do with the item, he just gave it to me and told me to keep onto it. From where i was stood, there was no action of him trying to take it back, just saying "no" Icly, but my character says no to thinks she doesn't want, doesn't mean i want that ooc too.

It wasn't clear ooc, there was no whisper to say "no please don't throw that i need it for a plot" or such. But hell.. make RP out of it.. go find a scryer and take some people on an adventure to find it as we said!

Izaa wrote:Also. You shouldn't have to "attempt" every single action you emote. Soon we'll hear someone has to attempt to drink from their own glass.
No but seriously. Even writing "stabs X in the belly" doesn't need an attempt. Because that is infact an action. They stab for the belly, it's up to you to determine if it's successful or not, the "attempt" seriously isn't needed UNLESS the stabber is the kind of person who would complain OOCly afterwards that it was indeed a force. But that tells us two things. It's rare people do that, and those who do are the true godemoters and not worth your time.


If they failed to emote "attempts" to snatch a key. You can still emote trying to prevent it, or grab their hand/wrist.
Did you? If you didn't. Why not?

This. Another character is only as powerful as the receiving player perceives them to be, no matter what kind of "god-emote", "kill-emote", they write on their side the opposite player is still in control of their own character and has every right and opportunity to say "you know what, no".

It takes two to roleplay : x

I have to say, I am impressed how focused this became on something that i tried to avoid. I avoided names and guilds on purpose to not draw this out into the open. This post was as i earlier stated an attempt to see where this server draws the line between what is the owners responsibility or the instigators responsibility. End of the day you guys seem to more bothered about defending the situation that happened not looking at the concept i asked about. Which is fine, If you want to turn this into a bitching thread then by all means. But when i got called on skype (without being asked if i wanted to be dragged into the call at 2am over something i thought i had dealt with in a better way. Learn from the experience type deal) to "sort" this out. I assumed it was done with. This morning this has happened? Explain to me who is the bitchy one here cause i am confused at this point.

Either way.. Off topic and i would like to return it to the original concept. Where do you draw the line on who has the responsibility. Last night i was lead to understand that >ME< the owner has responsibility where as before that i belived it is on the thief to ask. Different views of the outcome...

Alastir wrote:Either way.. Off topic and i would like to return it to the original concept. Where do you draw the line on who has the responsibility. Last night i was lead to understand that >ME< the owner has responsibility where as before that i belived it is on the thief to ask. Different views of the outcome...

From what I gather, she was not in fact a "thief", and you in fact totally willingly surrendered the item, without telling her anything OOCly about its importance. Due to your willingness, it is completely and utterly natural to assume that it was unimportant. Do we really need to ask people about everything? If my character gets handed a mug, do I need to /w the other player to check whether the mug is actually an integral plot device?

As others have said before me, you should never hand something important to a plot away willy-nilly to someone who is totally unaware of its importance without first telling them OOCly. In this instance, you are solely the one to blame for the loss of your plot device for being so wreckless with it in the first place. RP is by it's very nature volatile and unpredictable, you should never ever expect anything to go as planned IC if the other players have had no OOC guidance from you.

Alastir wrote:I avoided names and guilds on purpose to not draw this out into the open.

If you hadn't wanted to "draw this out in the open", you wouldn't have made a post about it.

I drew it out into the open because I didn't want people talking hypotheticals about something which I knew you were pinpointing at certain players, myself included. I gave your words context because if you're going to make a thread like this, you should be able to take criticism and speak openly.

We're defending the situation because you outed it as God emoting. Plenty of people have responded to where the server draws the line.

This morning, this has happened, because you posted a thread on the forums at 2am - these forums are active! People like to give their opinion, that's the entire point of a forum, and people you have outed were sleeping during the time it was posted (e.g. Cathee)

I was going to leave the Skype situation out of this to avoid pointless forum drama but in all honesty, I asked for you to be brought in so you could speak to me as you were only targetting Iriel and Stormy in game - both of which were not prime roles in your concerns (in fact, I think you only targetted them because they're women irl, but that'll divert this topic big time)

Either way.. Off topic and i would like to return it to the original concept. Where do you draw the line on who has the responsibility. Last night i was lead to understand that >ME< the owner has responsibility where as before that i belived it is on the thief to ask. Different views of the outcome...

1. There was no thief. The item was the centrepiece to the role-play and Cathee was directly involved in it. You gave the item to Stormy.

2. No one was informed of the centimental/event value of the item. You can't expect every time someone approaches someone to have to ask them to do every action. You can say the word "attempts" as Amaryl pointed out, which was done. It's then your responsibility to decide whether the attempt was successful or not. If you do nothing about it, then we're going to assume it's all okay. I gave you so much time, like four seperate lines of dialogue and four seperate emotes, to prevent Vaell from teleporting the item and I assumed it was fine as you didn't say a word to me.

Vaell wrote: (in fact, I think you only targetted them because they're women irl, but that'll divert this topic big time)

Right, So... Nice attempt to make me look like a chauvinistic pig but... if you want to play that sort of game i'm happy to bite and explain exactly why i spoke to who i spoke to.

Okay, So... Speaking to Iriel - I spoke to Iriel because 1, She was present at the end of the event. So would have some sort of insight about the thing i was having the issue about. 2, She is an officer within the Regiment, The guild in question which 2 of the three people was involved belonged to. So i felt that was the best person to talk to because i wouldn't have to explain the entire thing over and over again.

Secondly, Speaking to Stormmy. the only thing i have said to storm in the last few days about this. Is how i felt about the situation and asking her this afternoon whether or not it was her or Zel who invited into that call without asking. Which again... Seems to be something lost in translation when i say common sense to me but not to everyone else. End of the day i had no issue with her and none of the other people involved. Just the with lack of consultation about the end result.

Now moving on to your own comment about women. Would you care to elaborate. I went to one because i thought she was in a position of power to resolve the issue. I admit it escalated because of my own anger at the situation and i apologized for that. And i went to storm because this isn't the first time that i had to OOC'ly attempt to resolve something i didn't want to happen. - Just to clarify for the third time. THE EVENT IS NOT WHAT I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH, THE EMOTES IS NOT WHAT I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH...

I WANT TO CLARIFY WHERE THE LINE GETS DRAWN IN GENERAL CONSENSUS BETWEEN WHO HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY TO CONTACT THE OTHER PLAYER(S) INVOLVED IN SOMETHING THAT IS CLASSED AS A CRIMINAL ACTIVITY, THEFT, ASSAULT etc... Not drinking out of a cup like someone else mentioned earlier. An event that results in two players and something that could be potential an unwanted action. Is it so difficult to think not as your character but as a player behind a screen if this has some significance etc... Stop hanging on to the event that happened. This is simply a discussion about where that line is drawn...

Wow this thread soon became the circle jerk that i've come to expect from Defias RP hasnt it great job guys really. You know instead of attacking people for offering a different opinion on RP than yours with absolutely rediculous statements like this Vaell:

(in fact, I think you only targetted them because they're women irl, but that'll divert this topic big time)

Stick to the OP and comment on that you moron. Which frankly as far as I was concerned had been addressed by page 1, and none of this bile from you all jumping on one person for offering a difference of opinion wasnt needed. But good job.

Alastir wrote:I have to say, I am impressed how focused this became on something that i tried to avoid. I avoided names and guilds on purpose to not draw this out into the open. This post was as i earlier stated an attempt to see where this server draws the line between what is the owners responsibility or the instigators responsibility. End of the day you guys seem to more bothered about defending the situation that happened not looking at the concept i asked about. Which is fine, If you want to turn this into a bitching thread then by all means. But when i got called on skype (without being asked if i wanted to be dragged into the call at 2am over something i thought i had dealt with in a better way. Learn from the experience type deal) to "sort" this out. I assumed it was done with. This morning this has happened? Explain to me who is the bitchy one here cause i am confused at this point.

Either way.. Off topic and i would like to return it to the original concept. Where do you draw the line on who has the responsibility. Last night i was lead to understand that >ME< the owner has responsibility where as before that i belived it is on the thief to ask. Different views of the outcome...

Shove it. My post addressed precisely what you wanted it to without bitching. Perfectly legit.

I even gave examples and advice as to how it could've been done instead, which you can apply to the future.

Besides, your purpose of this thread was already tainted by your own semi-bitching, so don't be so quick to doom all the responses.

And quite frankly we're all humans, no one has more responsibility than the other, it's a joint-effort. You both could've pressed each other, both OOC for permission, and IC to make RP out of it. So many ways it could've been done and wasn't.

Izaa wrote:

And quite frankly we're all humans, no one has more responsibility than the other, it's a joint-effort. You both could've pressed each other, both OOC for permission, and IC to make RP out of it. So many ways it could've been done and wasn't.

Okay, I agree with that. And i wasn't dooming all posts. Just the ones that are hanging on the actual event. I do not know how many times i have no said i am not trying to bring it up all the time or taint the post. I am, at this point defending my self from being attacked over trying to get a simple answer and having the entire event retold... Which as i am trying to say again... Has no relevance to my opinion of how things should happen. This is simply an attempt to get a general consensus of peoples oppinions on the concept of what should happen in similar situations. Nothing more... nothing less.. Can people just let it go and think like normal people about the concept...

Vaell wrote: (in fact, I think you only targetted them because they're women irl, but that'll divert this topic big time)

Ahoy there Cap'n a white knight has been spotted on the starboard bow! shall we man the harpoons?!

P.S I agree with Celeste about this forum.

Alastir wrote:

Vaell wrote: (in fact, I think you only targetted them because they're women irl, but that'll divert this topic big time)

Right, So... Nice attempt to make me look like a chauvinistic pig but... if you want to play that sort of game i'm happy to bite and explain exactly why i spoke to who i spoke to.

I was responding to your Skype victim card.

Alastir wrote:Okay, So... Speaking to Iriel - I spoke to Iriel because 1, She was present at the end of the event. So would have some sort of insight about the thing i was having the issue about. 2, She is an officer within the Regiment, The guild in question which 2 of the three people was involved belonged to. So i felt that was the best person to talk to because i wouldn't have to explain the entire thing over and over again.

1. She wasn't present. She arrived after the item was teleported, she even asked what was going on.
2. A non-point. Both were off duty and it wasn't a guild matter in the slightest. The only relation to the Regiment was you blaming the guild for this whole fiasco.

Alastir wrote:Secondly, Speaking to Stormmy. the only thing i have said to storm in the last few days about this. Is how i felt about the situation and asking her this afternoon whether or not it was her or Zel who invited into that call without asking. Which again... Seems to be something lost in translation when i say common sense to me but not to everyone else. End of the day i had no issue with her and none of the other people involved. Just the with lack of consultation about the end result.

It did not seem that way.

Alastir wrote:Now moving on to your own comment about women. Would you care to elaborate. I went to one because i thought she was in a position of power to resolve the issue. I admit it escalated because of my own anger at the situation and i apologized for that. And i went to storm because this isn't the first time that i had to OOC'ly attempt to resolve something i didn't want to happen. - Just to clarify for the third time. THE EVENT IS NOT WHAT I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH, THE EMOTES IS NOT WHAT I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH...

I can elaborate over a whisper/skype chat. It will derail it too much.

Alastir wrote:I WANT TO CLARIFY WHERE THE LINE GETS DRAWN IN GENERAL CONSENSUS BETWEEN WHO HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY TO CONTACT THE OTHER PLAYER(S) INVOLVED IN SOMETHING THAT IS CLASSED AS A CRIMINAL ACTIVITY, THEFT, ASSAULT etc... Not drinking out of a cup like someone else mentioned earlier. An event that results in two players and something that could be potential an unwanted action. Is it so difficult to think not as your character but as a player behind a screen if this has some significance etc... Stop hanging on to the event that happened. This is simply a discussion about where that line is drawn...

It's been answered about 10 times by various people.

Celeste/Ainathiela wrote:Wow this thread soon became the circle jerk that i've come to expect from Defias RP hasnt it great job guys really.

Burgen wrote:P.S I agree with Celeste about this forum.

No one is circle jerking in the slightest. People are disagreeing with someone who went straight to the forum to out people's rp, instead of speaking to them OOCly. The popular opinion just so happens to be the one I agree with. I am usually disagreeing with 90% of the people in this thread on these forums, no one has any reason to circle jerk my opinion.

erwtenpeller wrote:

Alastir wrote:I avoided names and guilds on purpose to not draw this out into the open.

If you hadn't wanted to "draw this out in the open", you wouldn't have made a post about it.

Wahey, this.

This thread is bitchy AF

Vaell wrote: People are disagreeing with someone who went straight to the forum to out people's rp, instead of speaking to them OOCly.

I went to someone OOCly, It turned into an argument. I went to the guild officers because i felt it was an issue best adressed by its Hierarchy... I didn't go to you because you wasn't the person who instigated it... As i said during the event "Blindly following orders" Thus it wasn't your idea. So my problem was not with you.

I also went to the forum, Made sure no names, guilds was used to prevent people feeling attacked when this was simply me expressing my view on the situation and my thoughts and opinions on how i would of expected things to happen. If people cannot see that and feel they have to come onto this post and defend them selves then they are the ones who made this into what it is now, not me.

End of the day, This is to everyone involved in this post now. People have answered and i am already formulating the general consensus is as you described on Skype. And my "Victim" card wasn't used as a victim card. It was simple me trying to find out who it was so i could ask them not to do it in future without my consent. I don't want to get dragged into calls with people i do not know or wanted to meet etc. The skype call its self wasn't too hostile and the end result of it i was happy with. I was simply confused how you felt i was attacking them because of there gender. to me that was just a coincidence to me. I don't care if they male, female, Hermaphrodite... I would say the same regardless... I'm happy to discuss the merits of your point on the forum because i have no reason to hide my opinion. I Rp with the pixels in front of me, not the person behind the screen so the sex of the player is... Irrelevant.

Either way, This is my last post on the thread, its gotten out of hand and something i tried to use to formulate the general consensus of how people feel a situation should be dealt with so i can apply that in the future has been turned into nothing but a bitching contest with people trying to attack me on the event not the concept.

Thank you to the people who answered with a serious answer to the concept.

Then lets just leave it at this:

Just whisper OOCly in future otherwise people can't be sure what is sentimental/important or not!

I apologise if I've insulted you, but I just cba with having some subtle bitch-fest over the forums.

Vaell wrote: but I just cba with having some subtle bitch-fest over the forums.

I just died.

Celeste/Ainathiela wrote:

Vaell wrote: but I just cba with having some subtle bitch-fest over the forums.

I just died.

I'm anything but subtle!

While I've been trying to figure out a proper response the thread seems to of calmed. I just wanted to add though that:

1. If you're the one that want something scripted in RP, it is your responsibility to inform the ones around you about this. Because the people around you are no mindreaders and expect RP to be unpredictable if no other info has been given.

2. I got angry and annoyed because one, the title of the thread implies that us, the ones involved have no common sense. You also explained the whole event, so whether or not you used names you still pointed this thread directly to us involved and not a general issue that many people have a problem with. You also refered to it as the same as godemoting, and that also pressed my buttons since I had not been confronted with this in whispers at all, but see it now this morning on the forum.

3. The reason I refered to it as the event and IC, is because it is such a small small issue, that can very easily be solved through IC course of action. And if it had been taken IC only, no OOC argument would of been needed.


And Vaell, what is these lies I hear you speading about me sleeping?! I never sleep! *shakes fist*  

*Looks up at the text above him*
Note to self, never mess with a pissed of Cathee..

I think with the kind of post made and the mention of codified subjects and guild(s) . It's clear that your point wasn't focused and that most are not seeing the point you're trying to make because it simply is not.
You simply fail to see that -everyone- just like you have a background story and objective that they're characters may have , just like you ....
But that they by roleplaying with others story changes or deviates....
The point from your post had been and is being discussed it is simply not having the response you hope to have.

That is not how things work ...

This thread needs locking, its been said time and again that the community at large prefers spontaneous RP, and the OP in the first page has come to accept that and said that if people would read it. Yes he used the event that happened last night as cause for his point but because I read the actual post, I saw he was asking for a general consensus on all RP, not a justification for what happend last evening.

He has been given one, drop it.

Not to mention that roleplaying means react to others or roleplaying with them , if you're going to freak everytime that something happens that you didn't expect to ... Well, good luck on that.

Also if you're trying to imply that people's characters behaviour has to change (by ooc behaviour) and make them act like they would not because YOU have an idea and you want us to meta that knowledge to force it into making our chars act like they wouldn't that is meta gaming.