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Naaruvada 2.0: The Reboot.

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Seranita
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:43 pm

Due to the wall-of-text nature of this registry post, I have decided to kindly provide a neat TL;DR version at the head of the first post.

Naaru, not necessarily draenei guild.
Zealous, puritan, conservative.
Recruits all races and classes except warlocks; shamans, death knights and druids can only join as the lowest rank.
The three most important text, in order, are:
'Naaruvada Dogma'
'The Sacred Wheel of Deed and Thought & The Five Great Hindrances'
'Three Thrice-Tiered Tenants of Faith'
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The soul who dwells in loving-kindness,
who trusts in the Naaru's Teaching,
will attain that state of peace:
the blissful fading away of conditioned things.

By the Naaru, may it be so.


OOC introduction

What is the Naaruvada?:

Ranks:


The Naaruvada's opinion on other races and classes:

Recruitment:
In the next post, I will be sharing with you all the information relevant for Naaruvada role-play. Watch out; it's going to be a doozy!


Last edited by Thelos on Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:34 pm; edited 11 times in total
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:44 pm

Three Thrice-Tiered Tenants of Faith:


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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:44 pm

The Sacred Wheel of Deed and Thought & The Five Great Hindrances:

Naaruvada Dogma:
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:45 pm

Rite and Sacrament:


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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:45 pm

Naaruvada Hymnal:
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:45 pm

Lecture of High Priest Thelos the Illuminated:
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:46 pm

Naaruvada Meditations:
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:46 pm

Uniforms:

Draenei Discourses on the Inner Light:
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Post by siegmund Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:48 pm

Warriors/Rogues/Hungers <- Typo

Interesting read though!
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Post by Thelos Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:48 pm

And if after all that madness you are still willing to plunge head-first into the deligthful insanity that is the Naaruvada, please contact me so I can re-direct you to the nearest madhouse.

With love,

-Thelos.
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Post by Dr. Haluthious Vouten Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:59 pm

*SCREAMS WITH EXCITEMENT*

I'm a "Light-Less being" - YAY!
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Post by Celeste/Ainathiela Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:29 pm

<3 This so much
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Post by erwtenpeller Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:37 pm

I am a great fan of this guild.
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Post by Seranita Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:10 am

after some hefty reading and a lot of studdy this is an awsome guild concept and is very good.. there are however a couple of things that bug me.. If one could clarify..

firstly naaru are there.. they are a fact.. they exist.. thus it is not beleave and faith of draenei that worship them but is a knowing proof of the lights existance,, faith requires beleaf.. you cannot beleave in a fact as a fact is fact.. absolubt truth.. it is there therefore it is there.. sort to say.. as such I am very supprised that you are guiding the guild into the direction of zellous religiousness.. it.. makes me concernd..

secondly it is mentiond about chastedy.. normaly such a thing and religion is true..

however in the case of draenei.. they have sufferd genocide on no less than two occasions.. as such one would emagin there numbers are slim.. dangeiourously slim.. I would have thaught that as a race they would promote mating.. rearing large families.. bolstering numbers.. as even thow draenei are tecnicaly imortal.. they do sucome to death by war.. disease.. famin.. etc..this there is a need to breed or eventualy the race would die out.. this the whole chastedy thing is.. illogical..

thirdly.. only eating bread and water.. Malnutrition would sink in. death would result.. if that is all that they eat.. the vindicators would become physicaly weak.. loose muscle mass.. to maintain a physic needed to wield plate armour and heavy wepons.. they would need a high protine diet.. aka meat!!.. as such the dessision of only eating bread and water.. thow would be fine for a one off religious event lasting a week would result in dire concequences in the long run

i dont want you to take this badly but.. from all i have learnt from draenei ro.. this is heading into a very zelous rout.. someting the draenei as a race would be very cairfull not to go down.. as they as a race know the perils of what extreems bring.. they will have seen the end results of chaptarians.. scarlots and the like..

thow this is indeed a fresh intake on the naaru as a viewpoint.. I worry that this could do damage to most peoples opinions on draenei,

thow its true draenei are tough.. they are also a caring gentle race.. something that is being lost in the doctrins here for a very hardernd miletery/religious zeelos thing.. *points back to parrograph one about a fact bieng a fact and as faith requires beleave.*

I hope you understand my concerns (i do not mean to drop a doo doo in here Im mearly curious yet worried on the verge of caution)
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Post by Guest Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:21 am

i do vouch for monrena concerns. draenei are very different from humans in which they have learned the dangers of the ego. much like the arrogance of the eredar led them to become demons, and much like it was witnessed the scarlets turned the light into something to fear rather than love. faithful dreanei are generally humble and accepting.

Also, i do not understand why ban shamanism. LOTS of draenei sees the elements as the embodment of the LIGHT will and velen himself accepts the art and allow it to be teached and practiced within the exodar itself, right next to a naaru.

also much like monrena said, draenei are a dying race, that alone influence the culture into a direction in which reationships are endorsed.

i also remember huruma endorsing relationships as something pure, as to love another is to love the light. now the naaruvada cant love each others? i understand you try to avoid ERP drama but from an IC perspective it's contradictory.

do note i am merely trying to offer criticism and raise some concern about things that may hinder RP rather than promote it. huruma's strict code will exclude many people from an already hard to find player base.

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Post by Ixirar Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:34 am

Being that Draenei are truly immortal, they definitely wouldn't have the same need to reproduce as humans, and as such a small core of super-religious zealots vowing celibacy isn't a huge issue, in terms of population.
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Post by Bakar Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:59 am

Ixirar/Kavalis wrote:Being that Draenei are truly immortal, they definitely wouldn't have the same need to reproduce as humans, and as such a small core of super-religious zealots vowing celibacy isn't a huge issue, in terms of population.
But that's the point. Draenei are such an incredibly small population that something such as this would seem weird and perhaps even frowned upon? As said, they may be immortal, but they still die to a sword or disease just as easily as the other guy and they have been the target of mass genocide. So their population numbers would be at a critical number. At least that's what I think.
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Post by Ixirar Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:12 am

Immortality makes you immune to diseases in the Warcraft world.
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Post by Thelos Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:13 am

Quoting myself from the introduction post:

What we are not is a draenei guild. While it is natural for the Naaruvada to primarily attract draenei characters – since the draenei are naturally attuned to the Naaru – all races who are willing to learn about the Light and live according to the Naaru's teachings are welcome to join.
This is not a draenei guild. This is a religious cult that happened to have been founded by draenei: but we are ultimately hoping to include other races a well.

If the beliefs of this guild is something your draenei characters would frown upon: good! Bring on the frowning. It is not my goal to make a guild or a doctrine that represents the general mainstream draenei view. It is precisely my goal to create a cult of ultra-ascetic conservative nutjobs and judging from the prelminary reactions, I seem to have succeeded.

I agree with all of your points and have advocated them before. But for the purposes of this guild they are ultimately moot, because it is not our purpose as a guild to accurately represent the mainstream draenei point of view. If this leads us into conflict with draenei characters, this is something I would strongly encourage and be very excited about! Conflict is good. We are not here to bring harmony to the draenei community and unite them under one banner. Hell, we're not even here to be a draenei guild. If anything, we're here do do the opposite: sow discord and increase the breadth and reach of what a draenei character can be: includung the classic Knight Templar, the-end-justifies-the-means well-intentioned extremist characters that border on - and frequently cross - the edge of villainy.

I hope this clears up some questions and concerns you had!


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Post by Bakar Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:17 am

Ixirar/Kavalis wrote:Immortality makes you immune to diseases in the Warcraft world.
Well then I don't believe that Draenei are truly immortal, because there are several cases of Draenei being sick and dying from it. Think Shattrath and its lower area, it's even described as a filthy place. And I do believe there is a quest or two where you have to gather things to cure a disease for a Draenei, unsure. Lemme check.

Edit: Looked far and wide for what I could. But there is no mention of Draenei being more or less susceptible to diseases. So I guess that's totally up for grabs.


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Post by Thelos Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:25 am

Maybe it will help if I address Nihilia's points one bye one.

Nihilia wrote:i do vouch for monrena concerns. draenei are very different from humans in which they have learned the dangers of the ego. much like the arrogance of the eredar led them to become demons, and much like it was witnessed the scarlets turned the light into something to fear rather than love. faithful dreanei are generally humble and accepting.
Generally they are, yes. Draenei that decide to convert to the Naaruvada are the exception.

Nihilia wrote:i
Also, i do not understand why ban shamanism. LOTS of draenei sees the elements as the embodment of the LIGHT will and velen himself accepts the art and allow it to be teached and practiced within the exodar itself, right next to a naaru.
Many draenei do accept shamanism; the Naaruvada don't. If you will continue on reading, you will find that any Lay Profession is banned for proper disciples, including such things as farming, blacksmithing or hell, acting. If Shamanism is to be understood as a religious occuptation, it would be banned because the Naaruvada does not allow its disciples to practise any other religions; if it were a Lay Profession, it would be banned because its members are not allowed to keep practising their former Lay professions (like blacksmithing).

Nihilia wrote:i
also much like monrena said, draenei are a dying race, that alone influence the culture into a direction in which reationships are endorsed.
Perhaps it has; and if you think it should, I encourage you to use this in your role-play! The Naaruvada however would see this as a very bad thing indeed and would try to reverse this development.

Nihilia wrote:i
i also remember huruma endorsing relationships as something pure, as to love another is to love the light. now the naaruvada cant love each others? i understand you try to avoid ERP drama but from an IC perspective it's contradictory.
Huruma changed his mind. If it helps, you can assume he went nuts, since he keeps talking about his "Mission from the Light," and other cooky things like that. Again, I don't pretend like this guild concept and its progenitors are anything but zealous. It's quite nutty, in fact; and I wouldn't be suprised if there were some inherent contradictions, too.

Nihilia wrote:i
do note i am merely trying to offer criticism and raise some concern about things that may hinder RP rather than promote it. huruma's strict code will exclude many people from an already hard to find player base.
Thank you for your critisism! Feedback is always welcome and you raised some points I was eager - yet ultimate unable, it seems - to address in my first recruitment post. Thank you for raising and asking them!

All I can say about the last point is: tough. We're not here to cater to all players. From my experience making guilds in the past, I have arrived at the point where I no longer wish to make compromises on my guild concepts and wish to concentrate on creating the best possible quality of role-play I can create. I'm trough making compromises to include as many kinds of players and characters as possible. I'm done with the overly-vanilla guild concepts that ultimately don't have any meat in them because they are trying to provide for all. Again, I will repeat this as many times as I have to, because it bears repeating: we are not a draenei guild. The purpose of this guild is not to become "The Draenei Guild" (tm) like Ere Argus was, or like how Natures Grasp was for Elves or the Three Hammers for Dwarves. This concept is much more specific and yes, excludes many characters by design.

I hope this helps awnsers some questions and concerns you all had!
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Post by Thelos Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:43 am

And now, on Monrena's points:

Monrena wrote:
firstly naaru are there.. they are a fact.. they exist.. thus it is not beleave and faith of draenei that worship them but is a knowing proof of the lights existance,, faith requires beleaf.. you cannot beleave in a fact as a fact is fact.. absolubt truth.. it is there therefore it is there.. sort to say.. as such I am very supprised that you are guiding the guild into the direction of zellous religiousness.. it.. makes me concernd..
Religion can take on many forms and has many faces. Not all those faces are nice. I indeed want to steer the guild in a zealous, religious dimension; and your concern in this case is encouragement for me! If your character strongly disagrees with the Naaruvada's views - try to stop us from gaining influence and stand against us! I encourage that kind of conflict.

Monrena wrote:
however in the case of draenei.. they have sufferd genocide on no less than two occasions.. as such one would emagin there numbers are slim.. dangeiourously slim.. I would have thaught that as a race they would promote mating.. rearing large families.. bolstering numbers.. as even thow draenei are tecnicaly imortal.. they do sucome to death by war.. disease.. famin.. etc..this there is a need to breed or eventualy the race would die out.. this the whole chastedy thing is.. illogical..
You're right: from a purely rational, sociological, scientific demographical point of view, you are absolutely right. Persuming the survival of the race is a top priority, you'd think breeding would be, too. However, the Naaruvada does not think purely rational, sociological, scientificly demographical. They are conservatives trough and trough: something as inconsequential as a genocide and a dramatic decline in population will not influence the core tenents of their faith, which are unchangeable and constant.

Also, keep in mind that the ones to actual take vows of Celibacy are a very small and elite group. Think of them as Monks. Did the fact that many Western European societies had or still have monks have such a big impact on the ammount of breeding? No, not really. The celibate monks are a tiny minority of the populace and I suspect it will be no different for us. Who wants to be celibate, anyway?

Ultimately the idea - from a sociological, society-planning point of view - is that you need a certain amount of enlightened priests in your society to guide the rest. They're sacrificing all those good and enjoyable things like sex and food so that the rest may benefit from the spiritual insights this abstinence bestows upon them. Whether this abstinance actually bestows anything is of course a matter of Faith, not of science.

Monrena wrote:
thirdly.. only eating bread and water.. Malnutrition would sink in. death would result.. if that is all that they eat.. the vindicators would become physicaly weak.. loose muscle mass..  to maintain a physic needed to wield plate armour and heavy wepons.. they would need a high protine diet..  aka  meat!!.. as such the dessision of only eating bread and water.. thow would be fine for a one off religious event lasting a week would result in dire concequences in the long run
Exceptions will be made for the Vindicator caste - perhaps I forgot to mention that, in which case: thanks for reminding me! As for the Anchorites...Yep, they'll be very poorly nourished indeed, with some very dire consequences. This sort of religious diet is murder on your body; yet, it is suppoed to grant you freedom from desire in return, something most if not all religions associate with spiritual insight: in the case of the Naaruvada, this is actually a canon fact. Freedom from desire brings you closer to the Light, according to the Naaruvada.

Monrena wrote:
i dont want you to take this badly but.. from all i have learnt from draenei ro.. this is heading into a very zelous rout.. someting the draenei as a race would be very cairfull not to go down.. as they as a race know the perils of what extreems bring.. they will have seen the end results of chaptarians.. scarlots and the like..
Well then, represent the Draenei race that is careful to keep their peers from going down the path! Try and stop us!

Monrena wrote:
thow this is indeed a fresh intake on the naaru as a viewpoint.. I worry that this could do damage to most peoples opinions on draenei,
Intentional. I want people to think more badly about the Draenei. If anything, the standard draenei is boring and there's much space for them to grow into more interesting creatures. A greater moral reach - from zealous, bordering-on-evil paternalism to understanding, sympathy and tolerance - is something I encourage.

Monrena wrote:
thow its true draenei are tough.. they are also a caring gentle race.. something that is being lost in the doctrins here for a very hardernd miletery/religious zeelos thing.. *points back to parrograph one about a fact bieng a fact and as faith requires beleave.*
Then let us represent the tough ones and you can represent the gentle ones.

Monrena wrote:
I hope you understand my concerns (i do not mean to drop a doo doo in here Im mearly curious yet worried on the verge of caution)
I understand your concenrs, Monerna: but paradoxially, they confirm me in my beliefs that this is the right direction to take the guild in. I encourage conflict and I'd like to think the Naaruvada's controversial beliefs and their hyper-evengelical activities will lead to plenty of conflict for everyone to enjoy!


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Post by Seranita Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:45 am

it answers my questions certainly Smile
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Post by Ixirar Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:51 am

That said, I'll be racechanging either my priest or my paladin for this.

I absolutely love this concept.
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Post by erwtenpeller Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:37 am

Some in the Naaruvada still cling to the old values of Thelos the Illuminator. Wink
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