Druidic Healing Interacting With Death Knights?

Point is, having the spells is fine. They are there, they are part of the game, acknowledge them. You don't have to use them exactly as they are in game mechanics, you can use them in a more realistic fashion, but you can't just pretend they don't exist.

Finally somebody tells it clearly. I find interesting that, in DB, complete classes and their skillset are completely ignored. So, a druid can heal, morph, fly, a shaman can call the spirits, a priest and a paladin can call the holy light to heal themselves and attack in battle, but the entire skillset of warlocks, dks and rogues seems wrong to be played? This is one of the things which pisses me off of DB. Most of the skills have a lore explanation, written right above the shiny looking icon. Your class determines your skills, and those determine what you can and can't do. Why a druid can make a green mystical glow which heals and regrow things(his own skill), while me, as a dk, can't even heal myself using blood runes(my own skill)? Why paladin x can go around smiting people(his own skill) while me, as a rogue, a proper one, can't go stealth*(which is the skill which defines me as a rogue)? I could bring another 100 hundred examples.

Wow is not a tabletop rpg, it's not a DnD, it's not your typical fantasy world. Wow is fantasy world created for a game. Lore is defined mostly by game mechanics, and viceversa. Sometimes can be frustrating, that's for sure, but the world you're rping in is this world, if you don't like it, open a private server where you decide the lore. Wow is a world of magic. Soulstones are mentioned in lore, dks skills(yes, even summoning your ghoul from nowhere, see Thassarian comic) same, and so on. Of course it's not like pressing a button on your keyboard, it takes time and effort, but the lore for such skills is there, and should be acknowledged.

About the querelle about soulblades and such, I tend to stay on Feral's side, and it's not the only thing I don't agree with Drustai's guide, though I get along with it, adjusting my rp in a way to make it have sense for both my opinion and the one of those I'm rping with.

*Not stating that skills should be used exactly as in game mechanics, for example when I stealth I always give people an OOC advise so they can react about my presence)

Longknife/Decurius wrote:

Point is, having the spells is fine. They are there, they are part of the game, acknowledge them. You don't have to use them exactly as they are in game mechanics, you can use them in a more realistic fashion, but you can't just pretend they don't exist.

Finally somebody tells it clearly. I find interesting that, in DB, complete classes and their skillset are completely ignored. So, a druid can heal, morph, fly, a shaman can call the spirits, a priest and a paladin can call the holy light to heal themselves and attack in battle, but the entire skillset of warlocks, dks and rogues seems wrong to be played? This is one of the things which pisses me off of DB. Most of the skills have a lore explanation, written right above the shiny looking icon. Your class determines your skills, and those determine what you can and can't do. Why a druid can make a green mystical glow which heals and regrow things(his own skill), while me, as a dk, can't even heal myself using blood runes(my own skill)? Why paladin x can go around smiting people(his own skill) while me, as a rogue, a proper one, can't go stealth*(which is the skill which defines me as a rogue)? I could bring another 100 hundred examples.

Actually healing yourself is one of the things I pointed out that I'm not against at all, I'm also not against stealth as an idea but rather the fact that it can be used as invisibility mechanicly rather then sneaking as it symbolizes

Of course wow is not D&D or a tabletop RPG and I dont think anyone in this thread or anywhere else related has said that you cant do this or that. If you cant have opinion and share your thoughts then what is this forum good for? For me discussing this and being offered the view of other role players helps to bring depth to a mechanicly very shallow RPG (dont get me started on the storytelling at times aswell but this is not the right place). I'm not role playing to be right about everything either, I'm role playing because I enjoy the immersion and part of the immersion are these kinds of details for me. It's not "DB" ignoring skillsets or whatever, it's individual players having opinion rather then stating "ERMAGHERD YOU CEWNT PERWJ YEER KARAKTEER LERK THERT!"

@ Braiden

My post was a generic one I took a piece from Drustai because I thought just hit the point perfectly. I agree that wow rp sometimes(most of the times, when lore is ivolved) can be a bit odd, to say the least, but alas. Personally, I get along with almost everything, even if I perhaps don't agree with the interpretation given by the player of the lore. As said, I tend to compromise between my own and other's interpretation, as long as it doesn't touch the certain lore(for example, one playing a 'living' dk, or a worgen born worgen, or else).

Why is it always dks : /

Why is it always dks : /

?

There are always huge posts about DKs with divided and normally uninformed opinion. DKs are not even relevant atm really. It is just an observation really but everyone seems drawn to DK lore discussions.

Cause they suck.

<3 so you can't get mad Lexgrad.

No.

It's because there are so many shit DK role-players that people always have to explain everything point by point to them and discuss every single nook and cranny.

Wrong mostly, there are shit RPers of all classes really, and the insane belief that DK RPers do not have alts. I agree with your summing u of the situation eph but not the wisdom behind it.

Braiden wrote: "ERMAGHERD YOU CEWNT PERWJ YEER KARAKTEER LERK THERT!"

I approve of this message.

Lexgrad wrote:Wrong mostly, there are shit RPers of all classes really, and the insane belief that DK RPers do not have alts. I agree with your summing u of the situation eph but not the wisdom behind it.

<3 Yep, that's the thing. Besides, everyone, when it comes to DKs, seems to think they know best of the fellow rper. One thing that everyone should do, imho, is to try to effectively rp one, instead of babbling against others' interpretations of DK lore. Differently from other classes, whose lore is shaky at best(I think of locks, but also some races' priests, shamans or even paladins) DK lore is very much precise in many things, but also lets much room for personal interpretation. Instead of fingerpointing, try to make one, and accept the challenge. I knew, when I rolled one for rp that people would have eyerolled, and that it'd have been hard, from an OOC and IC perspective. But, more than that, stop with the whole:"NO! That's lorebreaking!" when it's just personal interpretation of things. Rp is a game of creativity and imagination. Stay true to the lore, but the true official lore, not player made 'rules' which are detriment to this exercise of creatvity. The lore is precise enough to tell you some things you certainly can and can't do, but is also vague enough to give you room to work on the whole of the other things.

('Rules' such as not godemoting, not poweremoting, not godmodding and so on aren't rules of lore or about good or bad rp in reference to immersion, but are rules of good education, imho)

I know this is a bit of an older topic. I read through it quite a while ago as I was drawing up my own concepts on DK RP and now that I'm registered I can contribute. I'm going to include the way I see Druid healing first but I'm also going to post how other types of healing work since it seems like a good place to discuss overall healing of Death Knights as well:

Druidic (Nature):

Druidic healing is one that accelerates that natural regrowth of cells in the body. As a Death Knight you know well that your cells are dead and no longer have a “natural” healing process to them. You will however regenerate through use of runic power in some capacity. The druidic healing does little to interact with your runic power. instead it will temporarily restore parts of your body to living cells. Once the outlining areas around the wound have been restored temporarily to living cells, those cells can be replicated and allowed to heal the wound. Once the Druid stops casting their spell, those living cells will immediately be corrupted by your body and return to nothing but dead cells. This form of druidic healing takes far greater concentration and effort than healing a living being and is far less effective on the Death Knight than other abilities.

Holy (The Light):

When being healed with the light, any wounds on your body are being cauterized. The Light is an incredible way to heal all wounds, repair all damage, but it comes with a tremendous cost. You may not feel pain or have at least a dull sense of pain, but it comes to Light you will feel as if every part of your body is simultaneously combusting at once. Still, if you are able to withstand the pains of being healed with Holy magic, it is incredibly effective.

Shamanistic (Elemental):

Shamanistic healing revolves around calling upon the elements (namely Water) to wash over the wounds and heal the target. With this the elements are used to rebuild based upon the elemental coding of what they’re healing. Despite your cells being dead, they do still carry an elemental code which serves as a blueprint of sorts to allow healing. The effectiveness of using elemental healing is limited as the dead cells do not react as quickly or effectively as living cells. Because of this a large portion of the elemental energy is wasted.

Monk (Chi):

Chi is a supernatural energy that surrounds all things. Monks will use their own chi (which appears as a mist) to repair the chi of whomever they are healing. As a Death Knight, balance is something that can be quite confusing or quite natural. Your inner balance will be reflected in the healing. The use of chi is similar to Shamanistic as the mists wash over the wounds.

Arcane/Shadow:

The necromancy used to create you Death Knight body is a form of arcane energy. Arcane energy and the abilities used by Shadow Priests are similar and can actually help to accelerate or renew the unholy energy which fuels your body. It should be noted that an influx of Arcane/Shadow energy will not by itself heal your body but rather it is the excess of the unholy energy that you will be able to turn into runic unholy power that you can use to fuel your necromancy healing. As a sub-topic to this, there is also the use of Death Coil which carries the same Arcane type energy to assist in the healing of an undead ally.

Regeneration:

As a Death Knight, it is important to be aware of how your body regenerates. Being undead, you can easily survive damage to your corporal body that would otherwise be fatal to a living creature. Though your cells are dead and will not replicate, your runic power will help to create and heal tissue. It is important to note that your body will only regenerate when in range of your soul anchor. If the entirety of the body is destroyed then it will regenerate at whatever location the soul anchor resides. There are several ways that this regeneration works:

• • Natural Regeneration
  o Your body is able to naturally regenerate by using latent runic power flowing through the body. This can be a rather slow process unless other functions are temporarily shutdown in order to allow a full flow of runic power sent to the regeneration needs.
  • Digestive Healing
  o Though your digestive track may not function as it did while you were alive, it is possible to pull runic power from foods consumed. Rotting flesh or undead flesh carries the higher potency of runic power, though living flesh may still serve a purpose to this end, it will not carry the same level of power for you to draw from. Still, the living flesh can be used as a nutritional source for your bloodworms.
  o Consuming certain herbs that contain high levels of undeath can help promote regeneration. (Ex: Ancient Lichen, Grave Moss, Ghost Mushroom)
  • Blood Bathing
  o Dousing yourself in the blood of a fallen enemy is a quick way to promote healthy regeneration. Blood worms will be vitalized by the flow of blood and as the blood washes over any wounds, your body is able to absorb some of the blood to feed its regeneration.
  • Bloodworms
  o Bloodworms are present in the body of a Death Knight, generally as an extension of their former circulatory system. Bloodworms require a significant amount of care and above freezing temperatures for them to be optimally used.
  o Bloodworms feed off not only the blood in the Death Knight’s body but can also consume contents of the digestive track or blood poured over the body into open wounds. There are special mixtures called Bloodmeal that promotes healthy Bloodworm care.
  o Bloodworms have a unique ability to synthesize runic power and regenerate lost or damaged parts of the body. They are one of the fastest forms of regeneration.
  

EShadowsong wrote:Regeneration:

As a Death Knight, it is important to be aware of how your body regenerates. Being undead, you can easily survive damage to your corporal body that would otherwise be fatal to a living creature. Though your cells are dead and will not replicate, your runic power will help to create and heal tissue. It is important to note that your body will only regenerate when in range of your soul anchor. If the entirety of the body is destroyed then it will regenerate at whatever location the soul anchor resides. There are several ways that this regeneration works:

There is nothing that states that runeblade anchors regenerate death knight bodies. It's one of the key differences between them and liches. A DK that dies, regardless of distance from their anchor, is dead and their soul trapped in the anchor, if they want to be revived it will require the efforts of someone else (typically a necromancer) to do so. Only a phylactery will actually reform the body of its master after their death.

• • Digestive Healing
  o Though your digestive track may not function as it did while you were alive, it is possible to pull runic power from foods consumed. Rotting flesh or undead flesh carries the higher potency of runic power, though living flesh may still serve a purpose to this end, it will not carry the same level of power for you to draw from. Still, the living flesh can be used as a nutritional source for your bloodworms.

Living flesh is superior to undead flesh. There's a reason most forms of undead have a drive to consume the living while typically leaving their undead companions alone. Undead flesh is already "spoiled", the life energy has already been used. It can help, sure, but fresh life energy is what they desire most of all.

Drustai wrote:

EShadowsong wrote:

• • Digestive Healing
  o Though your digestive track may not function as it did while you were alive, it is possible to pull runic power from foods consumed. Rotting flesh or undead flesh carries the higher potency of runic power, though living flesh may still serve a purpose to this end, it will not carry the same level of power for you to draw from. Still, the living flesh can be used as a nutritional source for your bloodworms.

Living flesh is superior to undead flesh. There's a reason most forms of undead have a drive to consume the living while typically leaving their undead companions alone. Undead flesh is already "spoiled", the life energy has already been used. It can help, sure, but fresh life energy is what they desire most of all.

That's what I thought, yeah.

Drustai wrote:There is nothing that states that runeblade anchors regenerate death knight bodies. It's one of the key differences between them and liches. A DK that dies, regardless of distance from their anchor, is dead and their soul trapped in the anchor, if they want to be revived it will require the efforts of someone else (typically a necromancer) to do so. Only a phylactery will actually reform the body of its master after their death.

See I really feel this is dependent on the runeblade that you posses. Now the way I see Death Knights, is that they rank on the same level as the Lich. Lich are capable of binding their own soul to the reliquary similar to what I believe the DKs are able to do with anchoring their soul to their runeblade. Interestingly enough, Eliza's anchor isn't her runeblade, it's something else which remains a secret. Though her weapons are always runeforged. I'll break down the way I see the anchors working by blade:

Vampiric Runeblade: Vampiric blades are capable of stealing the souls of their victims and also over time consume the soul of the wielder. Their soul is not so much anchored as it is sealed within the runeblade. Once the wielder's corporeal form is destroyed, the blade goes inert and tries to find a new wielder to once again start the cycle. Basically this type of a blade has a parasitic relationship with the wielder.

Non-Vampiric Runeblade: As I've said this is the blade I believe PC DKs wield. Since they are able to runeforge and anchor anything they want, they could run outside, pickup just a standard iron sword laying on the ground that has no magical abilities, and then runeforge. Due to this I see the relationship being more of a symbiotic as the Death Knight has subjugated the anchor. As I said I see no reason that DKs haven't learned the same soul binding technique the liches use, the only difference being that DKs must keep their anchor with them at all times.

Drustai wrote:Living flesh is superior to undead flesh. There's a reason most forms of undead have a drive to consume the living while typically leaving their undead companions alone. Undead flesh is already "spoiled", the life energy has already been used. It can help, sure, but fresh life energy is what they desire most of all.

I always went with undead flesh having higher levels of runic power (a necrotic energy) due to the decay. Rather than feeding off the flesh directly, Eliza pulls the runic power from the flesh as it continues to rot. I could be wrong though.

EShadowsong wrote:I could be wrong though.

It contradicts most tropes there are about the undead feeding off the flesh of the living. Your model brings to mind one question especially: Why would the dead not just feast on each other, if they can nourish themselves that way?

Drawing energy from rot is an interesting twist, though. The undead do seem to take a liking to diseases and nasty things.

erwtenpeller wrote:

EShadowsong wrote:I could be wrong though.

It contradicts most tropes there are about the undead feeding off the flesh of the living. Your model brings to mind one question especially: Why would the dead not just feast on each other, if they can nourish themselves that way?

Drawing energy from rot is an interesting twist, though. The undead do seem to take a liking to diseases and nasty things.

That's the thing, I'm not so sure that generic undead would benefit. They have less control over necrotic abilities and Death Knights are able to pull significantly higher control of necromantic energies. I always just use the rotting flesh as another place to pull that energy from rather than saying the flesh directly heals the body.

And that's fine! It fits the image of a fleshcrafter.

I suppose I should update my concept of "digestive healing" to specify the differences and uses of living vs decaying/undead flesh. To exemplify that for direct healing from flesh, the fresher the better. But to use the natural regeneration associated with runic power that undead/decaying flesh is better suited.

Eliza relies heavily on her runic power to heal, sometimes she will even shutdown all other functions and go into a comatose state to let her body repair after having been properly fleshcrafted.

EShadowsong wrote:

Drustai wrote:There is nothing that states that runeblade anchors regenerate death knight bodies. It's one of the key differences between them and liches. A DK that dies, regardless of distance from their anchor, is dead and their soul trapped in the anchor, if they want to be revived it will require the efforts of someone else (typically a necromancer) to do so. Only a phylactery will actually reform the body of its master after their death.

See I really feel this is dependent on the runeblade that you posses. Now the way I see Death Knights, is that they rank on the same level as the Lich. Lich are capable of binding their own soul to the reliquary similar to what I believe the DKs are able to do with anchoring their soul to their runeblade. Interestingly enough, Eliza's anchor isn't her runeblade, it's something else which remains a secret. Though her weapons are always runeforged. I'll break down the way I see the anchors working by blade:

Vampiric Runeblade: Vampiric blades are capable of stealing the souls of their victims and also over time consume the soul of the wielder. Their soul is not so much anchored as it is sealed within the runeblade. Once the wielder's corporeal form is destroyed, the blade goes inert and tries to find a new wielder to once again start the cycle. Basically this type of a blade has a parasitic relationship with the wielder.

Non-Vampiric Runeblade: As I've said this is the blade I believe PC DKs wield. Since they are able to runeforge and anchor anything they want, they could run outside, pickup just a standard iron sword laying on the ground that has no magical abilities, and then runeforge. Due to this I see the relationship being more of a symbiotic as the Death Knight has subjugated the anchor. As I said I see no reason that DKs haven't learned the same soul binding technique the liches use, the only difference being that DKs must keep their anchor with them at all times.

Well, it's a lot more effort than just 'picking up an iron sword laying on the ground and putting runes on it'. The sword itself has to be battleworn, and the runeforging process requires living essence from creatures emulating each of the three rune types. But I can see how you'd view it as more symbiotic, since the DKs do actually create their own blades rather than having it provided for them by someone else.

It's possible a DK could learn the soul-binding technique that liches use (something I've RPed with Dru, she's more a lich than DK these days), but the average DK wouldn't know it as it requires a very proficient understanding of necromancy. The average DK is dead if they die, no automatic revival. Liches are described as the exception, not the standard. They're supposed to be a different beast entirely from most undead, including death knights. While a death knight still maintains some link to their original body, a lich completely severs that and relies completely on the phylactery.

"The souls of the undead (Forsaken, PC death knights, ghouls, etc.) are imperfectly attached to their bodies; the dark magic that sustains them is a buffer that prevents their souls from properly joining with their bodies. This is why undead feel only faint sensations of pain or discomfort from most physical stimuli, and why the Light is so painful to their existence. The primary exception to this rule are liches, as liches bind their souls to a phylactery and then use the phylactery to generate a physical form; this process is why lich bodies look nothing like their mortal bodies, and also why you have to destroy a lich’s phylactery to truly kill them." - Nyorloth

Drustai wrote:Living flesh is superior to undead flesh. There's a reason most forms of undead have a drive to consume the living while typically leaving their undead companions alone. Undead flesh is already "spoiled", the life energy has already been used. It can help, sure, but fresh life energy is what they desire most of all.

I always went with undead flesh having higher levels of runic power (a necrotic energy) due to the decay. Rather than feeding off the flesh directly, Eliza pulls the runic power from the flesh as it continues to rot. I could be wrong though.

The thing is, the fuel is most potent when taken right from the tap. Necrotic energy is the end stage, where you've taken life energy from a victim and twisted and corrupted it with shadow magic until it becomes the unholy necrotic mixture that directly energizes the undead form. I can see how you could view the necrotic energy as the more potent, since it has already gone through the process, but I consider the process itself to be the major source of power. With Dru I RP the actual process of converting life into necrotic energy as the area where the most unholy pleasure and drive comes from. That twisted moment when something pure and good is turned into something evil and vile.

Essentially, I view life essence as the gasoline, and necrotic energy as the energy derived from "burning" that gasoline. Once burned, it rapidly loses potency.

The more a creature is rotted, the more shadow energy has sway and the weaker their necrotic mixture is. Pure shadow is emptiness, nothingness, oblivion, death. Undead are the in-between, constantly fighting off the shadow that seeks to reclaim and return them to proper death. A creature with extensive rot is consumed by shadow, and thus have little actual fuel to provide.

If you are going to feed off the undead, the juiciest and most "nutritious" ones IMO would be the ones with the least amount of rot. Perfect, pristine undead like other death knights, darkfallen, and so on. Those are the ones who'd have the most active (living) energy in the necrotic mixture. A living being is the most potent of all, though, because life essence is pure and ripe for conversion.