Re: Soul weave (ooc discusion and workplace)

by **Lavian** Thu Apr 05, 2012 1:16 am

Perturbo wrote:How is the thread dead...

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:31 am

Ok so we have all agreed that the soul weave is to be just plain necrotic.
along with this life force is agreed to be mana orientated. (if i read right)
The sword having a voice to the knight is how i see it to be keeping the knight from going insane from its problem of hungering suffering from the living its also the main focus of the soul weave magic Like i said not long back the idea of soul weave's weakness is the gem on the bottom of the hilt being the focus of the magic, Destroying this will end with the knight losing soul weave abilities.
I also wanna bring up a little rp me and the guild do now and then. the Alter behind Wolverton stead is in game a Twilight Hammer quest location for rp i sometimes refer to it as a point of increased soul weave magic, saying that i have infused it with a number of souls so we can resupply at the alter when need be.

Hope we can get the mental fluids moving Very Happy

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:46 am

Shadowrénd wrote:along with this life force is agreed to be mana orientated. (if i read right)

You didn't.
- Mana is the fuel of the soul.
- life force is the fuel of the natural body. Translated to game mechanics this means "health points".

- Magical efforts require Mana and eventually drains the soul.
- Physical efforts require stamina and eventually drains life force.

...This is to put it in completely abstract terms. They are closely related, and the both of them form the basic make-up of all natural life.
This is the way I see things, at least. I don't know if this is actually warcraft canon. I just know it seems to make sense in the context of the warcraft fantasy universe.

by **Braiden** Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:51 am

Shadowrénd wrote:The sword having a voice to the knight is how i see it to be keeping the knight from going insane from its problem of hungering suffering from the living

The classic death knight rune blades "voices" does the opposite tough, it would urge the knights to take more souls and hunger more... I'd say the "voices" should aim to break free will and turn the knight using it to want to wreak havoc and take souls all the time, this being said it would of course be possible to resist to some degree. I mean it's not a very righteous blade... it's interests would be to have more souls and power, not to keep "sanity" that may prevent the user from getting it more at a rapid pace.

Shadowrénd wrote:
I also wanna bring up a little rp me and the guild do now and then. the Alter behind Wolverton stead is in game a Twilight Hammer quest location for rp i sometimes refer to it as a point of increased soul weave magic, saying that i have infused it with a number of souls so we can resupply at the alter when need be.

I would have gone for a more hands on approach, having a jar of souls conveniently at hand seems a bit... dull and easy (plus where would one get these souls from?). To replenish energy one should have to kill and take the souls of the victims.

The thing about dark powers and awesome powerful runeblades is that they are evil and demanding to use and possess, the reason one would even be interesting to have on a character (if you're not just into being bad ass and powerful without drawbacks... which you shouldn't if you are genuinely interested in role playing) is the drawbacks such as hunger for sacrifice and madness if exposed to it a longer time.

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:55 am

Ok so.. del what should we consider soul weave uses.. scrap the idea of it being life force? is it mana or is it other?

Braiden id like you to help a little on the ideas you placing forward the point being the knights that use the weave are meant to gain more free will and be able to think on there toes the voices can be blocked out yes but im not sure on where to go with the alter i use it alot mostly as a meeting place so the idea its a soul fused point can be ditched

by **Kristeas Sunbinder** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:00 am

Delidah wrote:- Mana is the fuel of the soul.
- Magical efforts require Mana and eventually drains the soul.

I'd rather go with the use of mana as an alternative word for magical energies at their most basic and flexible (arcane elementals are conglomerate elementals of earth, fire, water and wind, rather flexible and mana surges and arcane wraiths are considere pure mana in some cases).
The use of magic became "widespread" as the waters of the first well of eternity got spread around. It was the source of all magic, but lifeforms (titan created and old god cursed) were still able to use and control that source.

However what you wrote down there would have peculiar effects on High and Blood Elves (and night elves, we all know what moonwells are for! Very Happy

) since they'd have to eat their own soul without a source of magic.

The use of souls as means to specific types of magic or as battery sources would lie in their complexity. To create life (organic or elemental) isn't something you learn in "Magic 101" and if I remember right is mostly something that Titans and Old gods play around with. Ofcourse leaving out sun knows the ritualistic and symbolic uses and purposes of a soul in magic.

by **Braiden** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:13 am

The point to the powers doesn't seem to me like a technique to get more free will but rather a way to revel in the fact that you are an unholy creature that needs souls and use these souls to power your OMGWTFAWESOME-spells. I don't approve of the idea of that at all... vampiric rune blades and increased free will doesn't quite match in my world, it sounds to me like you just want to pick the raisins from the cookie. If you want increased free will... well then I'd say your "soulweave" idea is not the way to go, there would be other techniques that wasnt about UUUUUNNNNLIIIIIIMITEEEEDDD POOOOWER imo.

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:17 am

Death Knights already have their free will, don't they?

Also, Kirsteas, I suppose you are right. I just have the neurotic compulsion (much like Drustai) to "connect the dots" if you will.

by **Braiden** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:19 am

Delidah wrote:Death Knights already have their free will, don't they?

Good point, tough it think the whole free will bit is referring to the addiction they carry.

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:23 am

Hmmmokay. Well... A runeblade that counteracts the need for a death knight to cause harm and suffering to replenish it's energy is an interesting concept, which i quite like. But you would need an alternative source of power to fuel their magically animated bodies. (Could be anything from life-force to fel, to arcane, to elemental and back again.)

by **Kristeas Sunbinder** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:30 am

Delidah wrote:Hmmmokay. Well... A runeblade that counteracts the need for a death knight to cause harm and suffering to replenish it's energy is an interesting concept, which i quite like. But you would need an alternative source of power to fuel their magically animated bodies. (Could be anything from life-force to fel, to arcane, to elemental and back again.)

Then one would have to study the animation magic well. And also that if there was a way for a death knight to get energy in a non harm causing way, wouldn't that be something a lot of groups and individuals would be interested in, I'd imagine there'd have to be a decent dark side that stops it from being the "better, faster, easier" way.

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:35 am

Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:And also that if there was a way for a death knight to get energy in a non harm causing way, wouldn't that be something a lot of groups and individuals would be interested in?

I don't think this is enough of a reason to not tell the story though, if it is a fun story. If defias can have it's own prophet-based light religeon, it's own split-off from Draenei light lore and a couple of other Defias-only things, I'm sure there could be a defias only group of death knights that has found al alternative source to uphold their existence. If it's a fun and interesting story, just like, tell it. You know. Very Happy

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:08 pm

I agree with Del and its the Main reason why i made this thread to try and help people have a word in the works of soul weave. All in all the idea of it was that dark casters and death knights learn it and form the court of souls.
If it helps.. i can Try to write down the whole history of the soul weave spell which can be... interesting to watch unfold and also reveal a few ic things i wanted to keep a mystery for some time to come still.

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:11 pm

Yes. The more history, background and explanations, the better our understanding will be.

Maybe you can even get someone with more advanced writing skill to clean it up a little. Wink

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:13 pm

I live with Zryse she will give me a hand.

by **erwtenpeller** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:14 pm

I might also be available to proof-read if it's not too long.

by **Lexgrad** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:19 pm

Or do not roll a DK. As Braiden touched upon, your rune blade will be so pissed if you are starving it. DK lore is clear on these subjects and most variation is simply "I want a DK who feels, can eat drink and screw like a living". IE not a Death Knight. The constraints on DK rp is what made it DK rp. If you want more freedom, dont be a DK, rp some kind of shadow thing.

Why must you have this and other self made magics shadow.

by **Elrua** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:21 pm

Because it's the free will of imagination. To go about as others want all the time, following the herd, limits imagination. To create your own adds aspects to the game which makes it fun for all -IF- done correctly.

Better to ask for forgiveness, than to ask for Permission.

by **Lexgrad** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:40 pm

I agree, unless thing get so off the rails and powerful that it makes others avoid RPing with you.

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:44 pm

thats why i made this thread lex to try and make it better for others.

by **Elrua** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:45 pm

Well, that's why I said if done right Razz

With my shaman, I don't like to think i'm limited to game mechanics with spells. There's not a lot that could be used IC (Heroism for example), So I mix and match, a swirl of fire for example - There's no reason why that's not possible.

Anyways, you are right. Personally, I do believe it needs to be explained a little better. I understand it fine, seeing as I live with the fellow and I can have 1-1 convo's Irl, however it's not my place to explain here.

by **Kristeas Sunbinder** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:46 pm

Lexgrad wrote:I agree, unless thing get so off the rails and powerful that it makes others avoid RPing with you.

That's why I'm wondering about the downside.

Depending on how powerhungry the individuals that use it are, it might be a "you tell anyone about this and your head will be on a pike" would work.

by **Kalitar** Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:51 pm

Kristeas Sunbinder wrote:
Depending on how powerhungry the individuals that use it are, it might be a "you tell anyone about this and your head will be on a pike" would work.

Thats why the Structure of the guild helps the ones that used soul weave to hide and others do the dirty work.

by **Skarain** Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:02 pm

*Plays her cards*

Maybe I can give some thoughts about Soulweaving

"Wall of Text:

Soulweave:
Soulweaving is using individual souls as a whole. Instead of drawing their energy the soulweaver dominates the soul with empty promises of freedom, promises of pain and torment or simply just with the sheer force of will. Called forth from the dark artifacts called < insert a epic name here > the soulweaver takes one or multiple souls out from their container and forces them to do his will. The souls are never truly released, and are pulled back by the dark power of the blade when their purpose is fulfilled.

Possible uses could be:
-Send a soul screaming their agony to an enemy, causing agonizing pain when stealing a part of their lifeforce akin a shadowbolt would.
-Send the soul to haunt someone, causing terrifying visions, horrible nightmares or leading astray.
-Send a soul to gather life from the surrounding plants and trees before forcing it to pass it to the target (and cause agonizing pain even if it would work as a heal)
-Force the soul to protect something, taking damage and weakening itself if not shattered entirely.
-Send the soul to do tasks for you, like lifting objects or passing messages to those who understand their whispers.

Limitations and Disadvantages:
-When multiple souls grant greater results the more souls are called the higher chance for them to banding together against the soulweaver, seeking to do harm to him or his plans.
-Overuse may cause your bindings to your own soul slip, turning it more unstable even if not joining the ones in the blade.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One way, if wanting to preserve the "weaving" part is to shatter a small portion of the soul, take part of the strands of mana forming the soul and weave it to a prison, web/cage like structure for the soul before sending it forward, or use the shattered soul in some purpose, or simply mold the soul temporarily into another shape to be used. Its all on planing stage, and the final outcome is not decided by me. I just help the way i can.

by **Kalitar** Sat Apr 07, 2012 5:23 pm

Skarains descriptions of the weave is perfect it describes, in my eyes, a much more balanced weave i like the ideas she has risen and want others to debate on it so we can advance it more.

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