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What can druids do lorewise?

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Dianthaa
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What can druids do lorewise? Empty What can druids do lorewise?

Post by Raenmar Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:57 am

So for all the time I've played a druid, I've never really understood what they can do. Obviously they can take the forms and traits of animals through their understanding of them and their relations to the Ancients (or something like that). I know that they have ways of cleansing land and water and making new life grow.

But what could they do in terms of fighting, against undead especially, excluding forms? I tend not to use stuff like wrath IC because it has no specific effect or explanation, seemingly just a gameplay mechanic. In what ways could they use nature to help them fight? What practical combat 'spells' or abilities would they have? And how could they protect themselves against different types of magics?

I'm just hoping Raenmar - as a druid - can be more use in the war against the scourge than entangling them in roots and swinging his sword helplessly against warlocks, but I've never really found anything specific about how they can fight outside of forms.
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Post by Drustai Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:32 am

Druids coax nature to fight for them. Vines rising up to grab at the feet and limbs of an opponent, insects swarming around them stinging and biting, calling upon animals or faeries to converge on the target, and so on. You can also draw upon the natural elements (primarily wind and air, seen in abilities like Hurricane and Cyclone), though to a lesser degree than shamans.

Also, wrath is perfectly IC. It is conjuration of life energy, possibly mixed with some arcane (there's nothing wrong with druids using arcane as it is quite natural and safe if not abused). Druids of all types also have connection with cosmic forces... stars and the sun, depending on if you are trained by night elves or tauren. Calling down the power of either of those is within the power of druids. Both tend to be highly effective against the undead, the sun moreso than the stars.

You can also use some shadow abilities. No, I'm not saying shadow bolts or undead. But things like accelerating the rate of decay in creatures and objects, encouraging the development of disease and sickness in your target, etc. All of these are part of nature... nature is not kind and sweet. It's actually rather brutal when you get right down to it. Death happens frequently, in some of the most horrible ways imaginable despite being perfectly natural. These kind of druidic abilities are something that is sadly ignored by most druids (lore and player), but there are some examples of it (look at Infected Wounds).

As far as protection goes... druids tend to be more about endurance rather than outright shielding. They tend to absorb attacks and rejuvenate from them. Still, there's always the old mainstay of turning your skin to bark to resist physical attacks, or using powerful gusts of wind to send projectiles off course.
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Post by Feral / Blackfall Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:55 am

I'm actually interested in this myself; my DK had a fight against a druid the other day, and none of us were particularly sure about IC mechanics of druid "powers."

For example, he was using instant gusts of wind to propel him about, which was interesting as a typhoon sort of mechanic, although I'm not 100% sure it's not more suited to a shaman?

And questions like, can you use Sunfire during the night? Starfire during the day? How would a death knight's unholy control of a swarm of insects interface with an actual druid's Insect Swarm (whose control would win out if they tried it on the same creatures, for example)?

And regarding druidic magic in and of itself; it's considered "nature" magic, but as far as ooc game mechanics go, part are arcane, part "nature," and meanwhile, I've had people tell me that the light of Elune (i.e. Moonfire, etc) is Arcane, or that it is "divine" in nature, or that it is actually a type of Light magic (i.e. my DK should be -burning-). And I can find 0 actual lore to tell me which is the case!

If a death knight attempted to rot a section of ground (a sort of death & decay mechanic, although not instant to avoid OPness), could a druid prevent that with his nature magic?

It makes for some very interesting creative possibilities, but without more truly canon lore basis to work with, it's hard Sad
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Post by Raenmar Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:32 am

Thanks for the reply, Drustai. So, if druids are able to use wind, could they also use water to some extent? I've always had Raen able to cleanse water by raising it from a pool and then, like... magic'ing it, and today I was told that they could call rain to cleanse land - 'infusing' the rain with druidic magic to cleanse the soil. But could they call, say, a storm or a typhoon? They're natural disasters rather than the raw element, so it seems to make sense that they'd be able to do that.

I know they could call on animals, but RPing in scourge-lands doesn't give much opportunity since all the animals are dead (although, there'd be plenty of insects). But would there be faeries? Since they're seemingly magical creatures, would they be able to be called no matter where the druid is? Or would I need to be in a place where faeries live?

What sort of effect would life energy like wrath have? As life energy I'd imagine it to just heal people, and I don't know what effect it would have on undead.

I never thought about sun/moon energy depending on Nelf/Tauren training, so Feral asked a pretty good question about that. Could I only use power from the moon at night? And, if it was day but Raen was trained by Nelves, would he be unable to use the sun?

As for protection, how exactly would they absorb and rejuvenate? Would they have some resistance to shadow/fel magic and be able to heal the physical wounds as they fight?

I was thinking for protection that the druid could coat their armour in seeds to absorb shadow magic. But, would that be frowned upon or considered as abuse of nature? Raen's shan'do once did a cleansing ritual by absorbing corruption into seeds and then destroying the seeds, but I don't know if it'd be bad to use nature in such a way.

If a death knight attempted to rot a section of ground (a sort of death & decay mechanic, although not instant to avoid OPness), could a druid prevent that with his nature magic?

That's also a really interesting question. I'd guess that it would be about willpower and that if they were standing on a line between clean land and rotted land, one side would slowly start to change depending on who was more powerful.

or that it is actually a type of Light magic (i.e. my DK should be -burning-). And I can find 0 actual lore to tell me which is the case!

That would be amazing <3 I'd no longer need to leave the scourge to the paladins.

although I'm not 100% sure it's not more suited to a shaman?

Bah, I've had that problem loads of times. I've never really understood how to draw a line between shamanism and druidism. Volcanoes, earth quakes and forest fires are all a part of nature. Could druids do all of that, just without control over the raw element?

You can also use some shadow abilities. No, I'm not saying shadow bolts or undead. But things like accelerating the rate of decay in creatures and objects, encouraging the development of disease and sickness in your target, etc. All of these are part of nature... nature is not kind and sweet. It's actually rather brutal when you get right down to it. Death happens frequently, in some of the most horrible ways imaginable despite being perfectly natural. These kind of druidic abilities are something that is sadly ignored by most druids (lore and player), but there are some examples of it (look at Infected Wounds).

This is brilliant :3 I've never really thought of it. But how would a druid give a disease to someone?

And to add one final and stupidly broad question to a ridiculously long post: How would a druid actually go about fighting a fel-user, a death knight or a demon? I know they could harm them with moonfire, possibly life energy? And the like, but they don't really seem to have anything specific to attack or defend themselves from the things they're intended to fight.
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Post by Drustai Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:29 am

Regarding using sunfire during night and starfire during day: I honestly have no idea. That's a question for someone that actually plays a druid and is more up-to-date on their lore.

Feral / Blackfall wrote:I'm actually interested in this myself; my DK had a fight against a druid the other day, and none of us were particularly sure about IC mechanics of druid "powers."

For example, he was using instant gusts of wind to propel him about, which was interesting as a typhoon sort of mechanic, although I'm not 100% sure it's not more suited to a shaman?

There is overlap. Both druids and shaman can manipulate wind, but shamans would be much more in tune with it. Likewise, you won't see a druid summoning up air elementals, while a shaman could.

This is an area where I say, let there be homogenization. There's no reason why shamans and druids can't share some control over the elements. Shamans specialize in it, and have a much closer connection with the forces that exist behind it, but druids, by virtue of their connection with nature, can also manipulate the more overt parts of it (a gust of wind, or a wave of water). The difference is that druids would only be able to manipulate what is already there, right in front of them. They could manipulate water from a lake, but they would never be able to summon water where there isn't any. Shamans, by virtue of having a direct association with the forces that control water, could possibly summon water even where there isn't any as long as some spirits of water exist there.

Overlap is fine.

How would a death knight's unholy control of a swarm of insects interface with an actual druid's Insect Swarm (whose control would win out if they tried it on the same creatures, for example)?

I'd probably give it to the death knight, because he is more focused on the shadowy side of nature (death, rot, disease) than the druid is. Though it'd really depend on the abilities of the two individuals in question. A druid that is 'in tune' with that part of nature would obviously have a lot of control over it, but most druids seem to focus on lifegiving aspects than on destructive ones like swarms of locusts devouring everything in their path (which is what I view the DK ability as).

And regarding druidic magic in and of itself; it's considered "nature" magic, but as far as ooc game mechanics go, part are arcane, part "nature," and meanwhile, I've had people tell me that the light of Elune (i.e. Moonfire, etc) is Arcane, or that it is "divine" in nature, or that it is actually a type of Light magic (i.e. my DK should be -burning-). And I can find 0 actual lore to tell me which is the case!

It's kind of both. It is arcane, but it's also divine. Afterall, many of the druid star abilities have been seen used by night elf priestesses as well. So I see those abilities as being part arcane, part divine (likewise for the sun abilities of Tauren, as, again, their use of it is based on their faith in An'she).

Consider that moonwells are a divine mixture of arcane (the waters of the Well of Eternity) and divine (the blessing of Elune). Therefore, it is very likely that druid star abilities and night elf priestesses likewise use this 'divine arcane'. In fact, Moonfire in the WoWRPG actually used moonwell water as a reagent (and we already know moonwell water is as potent as Holy Water when used against the undead). Therefore, such abilities would be very potent against undead.

If a death knight attempted to rot a section of ground (a sort of death & decay mechanic, although not instant to avoid OPness), could a druid prevent that with his nature magic?

Yes, definitely. Death and Decay essentially functions as a mini-Blight, and we have already seen druids able to cure Blight in the Plaguelands. Whose ability would actually emerge triumphant would, of course, but dependent on the skill of the two individuals involved.

Raenmar wrote:Thanks for the reply, Drustai. So, if druids are able to use wind, could they also use water to some extent? I've always had Raen able to cleanse water by raising it from a pool and then, like... magic'ing it, and today I was told that they could call rain to cleanse land - 'infusing' the rain with druidic magic to cleanse the soil. But could they call, say, a storm or a typhoon? They're natural disasters rather than the raw element, so it seems to make sense that they'd be able to do that.

Druids in WoWRPG actually had the spell Control Water. While the WoWRPG books are no longer canon, you could still draw from them as inspiration.

I know they could call on animals, but RPing in scourge-lands doesn't give much opportunity since all the animals are dead (although, there'd be plenty of insects). But would there be faeries? Since they're seemingly magical creatures, would they be able to be called no matter where the druid is? Or would I need to be in a place where faeries live?

You'd need to be in a place where faeries live. Druids aren't mages. While they can do some conjuring, they aren't summoners.

What sort of effect would life energy like wrath have? As life energy I'd imagine it to just heal people, and I don't know what effect it would have on undead.

Wrath is honestly hard to place. Anything I can think of for it is theoretical, and my druid lore isn't the greatest. Life does spur growth, but growth doesn't necessarily mean healing. It could cause rampant mutations, or heat stroke (high energy = high workload = heat), or stuff like that.

Also, I'm not positive on Wrath being life. It could be some kind of lightning as it does use the sound effect and does have a lightning look despite being green. Druids in WoWRPG did have the ability to manipulate lightning (via the spell Control Weather), and it would fall along the same line as their hurricane/cyclone/etc storm abilities.

*Edit* Aha, in-game confirmation. Druids of the Fang at least are able to use lightning.

As for protection, how exactly would they absorb and rejuvenate? Would they have some resistance to shadow/fel magic and be able to heal the physical wounds as they fight?

I was thinking for protection that the druid could coat their armour in seeds to absorb shadow magic. But, would that be frowned upon or considered as abuse of nature? Raen's shan'do once did a cleansing ritual by absorbing corruption into seeds and then destroying the seeds, but I don't know if it'd be bad to use nature in such a way.

Just look at the abilities you have in-game. Yes, you are able to heal the physical wounds as you fight. Life healing is basically an accelerated natural healing. All those DoT heals, like Rejuvenation? View those as IC. A druid gets hit, has a big gushing wound, but keeps on fighting, the wound healing as he goes along. Kinda like Wolverine.

Resistance to shadow/fel: Shadow yes. Druids focus on life, their magic channels life. Life counters shadow.

Fel, probably not. Fel is chaos, and corrupts living organisms rather than destroys them. Life does not counter fel, it could actually spur its growth. Think of fel like a cancer. Once it's in your system, providing it fuel might actually make it worse, since it provides it the energy it needs to grow.

The seeds thing sounds like an interesting idea. I can't say if it'd be frowned upon or not, but hey, druids already call on nature to fight their battles for them, so why would it be okay to use animals but not seeds?

This is brilliant :3 I've never really thought of it. But how would a druid give a disease to someone?

Those insects you call? Those animals? Animals and bugs are filthy. They are riddled with diseases. All a druid needs to do is weaken the target's immune system just a little bit to let those diseases fester. They could even poison their weapons, or their claws, strike the target, and then use their magic to destroy their immune system and make that venom unstoppable.

Druids can encourage the body's ability to heal... but they can also stifle it, destroy it.

... I really love the idea of blight druids, tbh. <.<

Spoiler:

And to add one final and stupidly broad question to a ridiculously long post: How would a druid actually go about fighting a fel-user, a death knight or a demon? I know they could harm them with moonfire, possibly life energy? And the like, but they don't really seem to have anything specific to attack or defend themselves from the things they're intended to fight.

For fel, you'll want to rely on your divine arcane abilities. Like the undead, fel and demons are weak against divine abilities. Your natural spells, however, will have not have any different effect on them than they would have on any common mage or warrior.

Death knights and undead on the other hand. First off, the divine arcane abilities will be absolutely killer to undead. Moonfire, sunfire, all of those are something an undead should fear.

Additionally, just consider what an undead needs to survive. The undead have a hunger for life. They feed on life. Now, druids can go about this in one of two ways. They could decide to destroy fire with fire, and stifle the undead's ability to consume life. For example, if you have a growing field of Blight... that Blight feeds on the land. By killing the land ahead of the Blight, the Blight would no longer have anything to feed on. Likewise, by limiting an undead's ability to feed, and more importantly, by destroying the life energy they have already absorbed, you could greatly weaken them (and in the case of sapient undead like death knights, drive them into their mindless rage state from the starvation). Undead are creatures of shadow, but they require life to remain animated. Infuse even more shadow into them, destroying what they've fed upon, and you'll drive them closer and closer to true death. Essentially, you are manipulating the natural forces of death to destroy the life it clings to and thus encourage the undead to finally, truly die.

Now, you could be a healy druid who doesn't believe that he should kill anything, or is very anti-shadow and would never dream of using it (as is the case with most). In that case, you could distract the undead with life energy. Gorge it. You won't kill it with life energy, but by fueling its hunger you could attack the discipline and intelligence that sapient undead require to be as powerful as they are. I know if some druid gave Drustai a 'feast' of life energy, she'd be in quite the rapture and might possibly lose herself in it. Probably would kill her ability to cast spells because she'd be able to concentrate on nothing but the feast. Again, won't kill her outright, but would definitely make her a much easier target.

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Post by Feral / Blackfall Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:20 pm

Aha! Thanks for all the replies, quite helpful!!

and we already know moonwell water is as potent as Holy Water when used against the undead

Do you have a source on moonwell water being as potent as holy water against the undead? I've looked for this quite a bit, and can't find anything about it. So far I've just kept my DK from stepping in the moonwell, but you never know when the necessity might come up. ...Right?

...Right?...

Thanks again!
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Post by Dianthaa Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:53 pm

I remember a thing druids seemed to do a lot in the books was carry around bag/pouches with various dusts/leaves/seeds that they'd throw at an enemy during a fight and use as an attack. I can't remember a lot of examples I'm afraid but I do remember one, having a bag of leaves that would grow and become razor sharp as they were throw at an enemy and the swirling around him and cutting him loads, I remember reading it and thinking oh so this is the explanation for cyclone, cause it was described pretty much like that. And I think some sort of dust was used as a stun or to slow, just threw it in the air and it seemed to slow movements.
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Post by Drustai Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:31 pm

Feral / Blackfall wrote:Aha! Thanks for all the replies, quite helpful!!

and we already know moonwell water is as potent as Holy Water when used against the undead

Do you have a source on moonwell water being as potent as holy water against the undead? I've looked for this quite a bit, and can't find anything about it. So far I've just kept my DK from stepping in the moonwell, but you never know when the necessity might come up. ...Right?

...Right?...

Thanks again!

http://www.wowpedia.org/Quest:The_Liquid_Fire_of_Elune

http://www.wowpedia.org/Liquid_Fire_of_Elune
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Post by Feral / Blackfall Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:56 pm

Thanks!
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Post by Thondalar Stormleaf Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:19 am

Question, whike we are on the topic of druids;

The animal forms, how much are they used ic? Does it take a lot of energy, is it more natural, ect.
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Post by Coppersocket Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:19 am

If you're thinking Lorewise, a animal form requires a lot of concentration, and learning. Having more than a single form is even more difficult, as you need to adapt even more. Druids usually only focus on a single form, as it's easy to simply lose themselves in that alone. (See the old, old Worgen for reference)

I doubt it'll take a lot off of you physically, but mentally it's probably very taxing, since you need to keep your sanity constantly.
As for natural, I doubt it's any less natural than your humanoid form, once you've gotten 'mastered' to it. However, as stated, you need to constantly remind yourself of who you really are, so that your new primal instincts don't overpower you.
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Post by Dréfurion Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:36 am

It's been said that the vast majority of druids are now druids of wild,
those with multiple form and skills. Perhaps a bit more jack of all trades, master of none. In fact, a quest that has been removed, claimed that the druids of the talon ceased to exist as an organisation.

I do not treat shapeshifting as particularily hard, but Drefurion had a fee centuries of training. Still I don't think it's as hard as actually doing the other druids magics because, to an extent, it's a gift given by spirits, an it becomes a natural thing fast.

I do see shapeshifting as a struggle between your humanity and animal insticts, I have my own theory that this is because the instinct are actively trying to take over, your desire for a simpler life (that got drefurion going feral) and the patron/matron ancient that first grants you the form wants you to become the animal it represents. This last point is highly arguee, but I think it shines through a little in that Druids of the Claw were told to keep bulky and wide in girth, like bears and other wise asked to live like 'em.

Worgen or worg form is a little special in that it is -impossible- to control, unlike all the other forms. You will go feral if you use Goldrinn's form.

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Post by siegmund Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:49 am

Hm, found out here how a DK or any shadow user could go up a DK , good to know.
But got a question then on druids.

Would Gilnean "druids", Those now with the curse but sane via the help of elves, Be then possibly better in using such forms and with less risk?

Though they would probably use the forms more diffrently than normal druids. As they already got worgen one for raw power.

As in this:
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=27510/a-wolf-in-bears-clothing

I imagine they would have less of a mental tax as well?



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